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  • My feedback: "Content is King"

    I am just stating my feedback that I am sure a lot of people would feel the same. I keep visiting the vb5 demo page and I get frustrated more per visit. Side note....What's the deal with the Joker theme? It is devaluing your beta software.
    I understand this software is in beta mode but I feel that the path you are travelling is the same as vb4. I am also aware the CMS will be added on in the future. The general definition of a beta software is: "a limited release of a product with a goal of finding bugs before the final release". For the most part a beta software doesnt have a major design change when it hits "final". For me, looking at vb5, that's discouraging.

    Personally I feel that vb5 is an uglier version of vb4. That's not a big deal since looks can be changed as demonstrated by the wonderful Joker theme. Question is: what is truly separating vb5 from vb4 in terms of experience for "our" customers? When I see vb5 I feel that it has most of the positive and negative values of vb4. I feel like a lot of resources and effort is being put in the back-end, coding & site structure. I am all for that, but again that doesn't effect our visitor's experience. Your real customers are our site visitors.



    Did you know that as of August 2011, Wordpress manages 22% of all new websites. If I was running vB, I would want a piece of that pie. Here is a business idea, create a free CMS application and then charge people for a forum addon. The years of standalone forum softwares are long gone. This software need to change with the times. Definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results.


    I firmly believe that "content is king". People visit a site because they are looking for something. They have a need, and they think you can satisfy that need. Proper content management is the primary and most important part of most blog type sites. After a while visitors stay and add value with on-going discussions via forums. Over time the increase in forums posts, increases SEO and add more traffic to site.


    So wouldnt it make sense to make CMS one of your primary goals? Why bother with Blogs and Groups that are secondary. Personally to me, they are useless. Facebook integration, albums, & activity stream, its all secondary too.

    All I ask is for a fluid CMS to forum experience. A decent CMS that is on par with IPB/WP/Joomla in the year 2012. Plus integration with a solid forums. Vb4 was on path to provide something promising but it feels like the construction on the building stopped halfway through. Now a new building is being built, but the blueprint looks dull.



    I really like vB and all their staff. I know that it is an impossible task to satisfy every customer. But I believe that there is a need and void in this market that vB can fullfil.

  • #2
    You can do a lot more with Site Builder. It really depends on your needs. If you simple have static content (articles), well you might miss the CMS yes. But for editing pages, using different layouts, etc. the Site Builder is perfect. More informations and things to try will come soon.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by nez View Post
      I am just stating my feedback that I am sure a lot of people would feel the same. I keep visiting the vb5 demo page and I get frustrated more per visit. Side note....What's the deal with the Joker theme? It is devaluing your beta software.


      Themes are subjective. Personally I think its a massive improvement over the look of vb4 which is somewhat dated. End of the day it will never be to everyones tastes, which is why most tend to have other themes than default.

      Originally posted by nez View Post

      The general definition of a beta software is: "a limited release of a product with a goal of finding bugs before the final release". For the most part a beta software doesnt have a major design change when it hits "final".


      It will not be released with 5.0 . It may well be 5.1 for example and therefore does fit the description above. Just looking at it from another point of view, Im glad its not being released with 5.0 as I dont want a half cut thing like in 4.0.


      I feel like a lot of resources and effort is being put in the back-end, coding & site structure.
      I would somewhat agree with that, however they gotta start somewhere with a brand new version right? At the end of the day if the backend, code and structure are not right the front end never will be. That said there are now many items backend that allow you to create a better front end for the user. Just for example on my own site I will be adding pages with tables showing the average size of huskies on a new page, along with a calculator that will give an estimate on how much food you should be feeding etc. Before it would have been too much work and I simply wouldnt have bothered as wasnt worth the effort involved.

      I firmly believe that "content is king". People visit a site because they are looking for something. They have a need, and they think you can satisfy that need. Proper content management is the primary and most important part of most blog type sites. After a while visitors stay and add value with on-going discussions via forums. Over time the increase in forums posts, increases SEO and add more traffic to site.

      So wouldnt it make sense to make CMS one of your primary goals? Why bother with Blogs and Groups that are secondary. Personally to me, they are useless. Facebook integration, albums, & activity stream, its all secondary too.


      Completely agree with this, however as said above, I believe for that very reason its a good thing we are waiting for cms. Blogs and Groups are not as involved as a CMS system and are pretty much posts (infact they are the same as far as back end is concerned) just reformated. Therefore its not so much that they have concentrated on them, its more a case of them already being practically there because of the design.

      All I ask is for a fluid CMS to forum experience. A decent CMS that is on par with IPB/WP/Joomla in the year 2012. Plus integration with a solid forums. Vb4 was on path to provide something promising but it feels like the construction on the building stopped halfway through. Now a new building is being built, but the blueprint looks dull.
      IPBs CMS is actually terrible to use IMO. Wordpress and Joomla are specialised in these areas and I agree I would love to see vbulletin compete with these.

      I really like vB and all their staff. I know that it is an impossible task to satisfy every customer. But I believe that there is a need and void in this market that vB can fullfil.
      You like em all? LOL
      Husky Owners Forum - For all Siberian Husky Owners

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      • #4
        Originally posted by soniceffect View Post
        Wordpress and Joomla are specialised in these areas and I agree I would love to see vbulletin compete with these.
        I would not. It would take at least 10 years of them to compete.
        Make a bridge to Wordpress and the pressure has gone.


        vB5 is unequivocally the best forum software, but not yet...

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        • #5
          Originally posted by beishe8 View Post
          I would not. It would take at least 10 years of them to compete.
          Make a bridge to Wordpress and the pressure has gone.
          Indeed thats the alternative. Just wouldnt fancy the idea of 2 lots of styling to be honest, however that would be my only reason for not wanting that.
          Husky Owners Forum - For all Siberian Husky Owners

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          • #6
            When VB focused on forums for all these years, they excelled at it and were top of the league, for good reasons

            As soon as they started splitting the workload between other addons, like the CMS, Blogs, mobile suite and all the other stuff, the quality overall just dropped considerably.

            I thought with their experience of VB4, they might have learned that lesson, but VB5, if anything, is an even worse repeat of VB4's launch.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Deimos View Post
              When VB focused on forums for all these years, they excelled at it and were top of the league, for good reasons
              True.
              I thought with their experience of VB4, they might have learned that lesson, but VB5, if anything, is an even worse repeat of VB4's launch.
              Ten minutes are the most I can fiddle with my vB5 test forum.
              I get confused because of the mess there and leave.


              vB5 is unequivocally the best forum software, but not yet...

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              • #8
                Originally posted by soniceffect View Post

                It will not be released with 5.0 . It may well be 5.1 for example and therefore does fit the description above. Just looking at it from another point of view, Im glad its not being released with 5.0 as I dont want a half cut thing like in 4.0.
                When did IB give this information out?
                Vote for my suggestions here and here

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Solitaire View Post
                  When did IB give this information out?
                  An email was sent to all customers about the vBulletin 5 Release Plans. This was sent on August 23rd, 2012.

                  In addition a thread was created with the information here: https://www.vbulletin.com/forum/show...-Release-Plans
                  Translations provided by Google.

                  Wayne Luke
                  The Rabid Badger - a vBulletin Cloud customization and demonstration site.
                  vBulletin 5 Documentation - Updated every Friday. Report issues here.
                  vBulletin 5 API - Full / Mobile
                  I am not currently available for vB Messenger Chats.

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                  • #10
                    Yea but that email didn't say that the CMS would be a point release. Nor did that email confirm or deny if this release (because it is on sale) is part of that release schedule that was outlined, or did it say that the CMS would not be in 5.0. For all we know Beta could end at 5.0.23 and 5.0.24 could be gold, and 5.0.25 could show us the CMS. I mean are you going by the same release naming that you used on vb4 (because from what I've seen thats kind of a big assumption for anyone to make without an official statement made like with 4.0 and the relationship of point releases) That's the information that I am unclear on. Are we in the release schedule that was sent out in August or not?

                    Edit:
                    Just saw this post
                    Originally posted by Wayne Luke View Post
                    The Article Publisher will come in an upcoming Feature Release (i.e. 5.X not 5.0.X). That will come in the future. This component will be rewritten completely and will not be ready for a 5.0.0 release.
                    But I have still yet to see that confirmed in any official email, and I notice you didn't state 5.1 like I have been seeing others speculate around here. I will take your word for it. I have to say that is completely a disappointment that we have to wait until 5.X to see the CMS :/
                    Last edited by Solitaire; Thu 1st Nov '12, 3:30pm.
                    Vote for my suggestions here and here

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Solitaire View Post
                      Yea but that email didn't say that the CMS would be a point release. Nor did that email confirm or deny if this release (because it is on sale) is part of that release schedule that was outlined, or did it say that the CMS would not be in 5.0. For all we know Beta could end at 5.0.23 and 5.0.24 could be gold, and 5.0.25 could show us the CMS. I mean are you going by the same release naming that you used on vb4 (because from what I've seen thats kind of a big assumption for anyone to make without an official statement made like with 4.0 and the relationship of point releases) That's the information that I am unclear on. Are we in the release schedule that was sent out in August or not?

                      Edit:
                      Just saw this post


                      But I have still yet to see that confirmed in any official email, but I will take your word for it. I have to say that is completely a disappointment that we have to wait until 5.1 to see the CMS :/
                      Email has the exact same wording as the post linked above.
                      Translations provided by Google.

                      Wayne Luke
                      The Rabid Badger - a vBulletin Cloud customization and demonstration site.
                      vBulletin 5 Documentation - Updated every Friday. Report issues here.
                      vBulletin 5 API - Full / Mobile
                      I am not currently available for vB Messenger Chats.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Actually your post was more explicit in saying (i.e. 5.x and not 5.0.x) where as the marketing email and post is as muddy as ever because how are we to even know that because it says,

                        "We will release the first update to vBulletin 5 Connect approximately 4-6 weeks after the 5.0 launch. This release will be focused on bug fixes, and will also include various non-English versions of vBulletin 5 Connect and possibly paid subscriptions."

                        and then it says

                        "The next piece of this phased initial release will bring to vBulletin 5 Connect article publishing capabilities similar to the current CMS in vBulletin 4 Suite. Tables and content for the current CMS will be imported into a new content channel regardless of whether the upgrade is done before or after this update, but that content will only be usable afterwards."

                        So its just confusing because it talks about "supposedly" 1 bug release and then the next piece of "phased initial release" is the CMS. When I see "phased initial release" I think these are all being added in a metered roll out of 5.0 assuming that gold will start over at 5.0.0 but we don't know that because no one has expressly stated that. 5.X would be a new feature release by conventional terms.

                        But like I said I'll take your word for it.

                        EDIT:

                        I mean you guys have to understand that the reason people keep asking where is the CMS and when will it vb5 be released, or is this the official release (because it is on sale) is not for lack of reading or looking for the information out there. These marketing emails that we receive are about as clear as mud, and give details that are hardly verifiable or rarely if ever pan out. It's very confusing when what most of us would like to see is a detailed event list so we can plan and strategize.
                        Last edited by Solitaire; Thu 1st Nov '12, 4:01pm.
                        Vote for my suggestions here and here

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Solitaire View Post
                          Yea but that email didn't say that the CMS would be a point release.
                          Neither did my post. I said for example
                          Husky Owners Forum - For all Siberian Husky Owners

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by soniceffect View Post
                            Neither did my post. I said for example
                            Yes I see that you have said example, but I have seen other posts around here that have said it would be a point release, and I was just wanting to know if I missed an email or something that expressly said it would be a point release. Because from that original marketing email for all we know we could be in the middle of the "phased initial release" right now, and Gold will start over with 5.0.0
                            Vote for my suggestions here and here

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Solitaire View Post
                              Gold will start over with 5.0.0
                              It will do exactly that.
                              My Live vB5 Site - NZEating.com
                              vBulletin Hosting | vBulletin Services - Need hosting for your vB? Need it installed? Something else? Let me take that hassle off your hands.

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