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  • #46
    Only thing worse then requiring 30 some odd script loads for the home page to even show up is loading those scripts from a number of different domains.

    I use and recommend the use of No Script add for Firefox and related plugins. It is a pain trying to guess what domains to temp allow just to be able to see the home page. We can not nor will we subject our hard earned userbase to that madness. '

    Sorry, forced JS as a requirement for a page to load is just wrong, and bad web dev / webmastering and should never happen or at the very least degrade properly (remember those <noscript> </noscript> tags? they were invented for a reason) so the page at least loads..
    Steve, Webmaster and Admin
    www.pokecommunity.com

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    • #47
      Originally posted by pokesph View Post
      Only thing worse then requiring 30 some odd script loads for the home page to even show up is loading those scripts from a number of different domains.
      The only one I see coming from a different domain is the jquery 1.7.2. Otherwise they all look to be embeded in the code or linking from a js folder on the install server.
      Vote for my suggestions here and here

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      • #48
        Some things have been changed to alleviate some of the JS issues and pulling proper data at the beginning. Doesn't alleviate all the issues and Javascript is still required but progress is being made to make it more usable.

        I don't know if the changes will be available in Beta 11, 12 or 13 but they are coming.
        Translations provided by Google.

        Wayne Luke
        The Rabid Badger - a vBulletin Cloud customization and demonstration site.
        vBulletin 5 Documentation - Updated every Friday. Report issues here.
        vBulletin 5 API - Full / Mobile
        I am not currently available for vB Messenger Chats.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Andy View Post
          Personally I really dislike pages loaded by AJAX because it breaks the back button and is very confusing to users. For example:

          1) go to this page http://www.vbulletin.com/vb5demo/forum
          2) click Main Forum
          3) go to page 2
          4) now click the back button, you're now back at the forum page, not back at page 1 as expected
          HTML5 history is the solution for that. I did not check if vB5 supports it or not though. If not, it can be easily added.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Riasat View Post
            HTML5 history is the solution for that. I did not check if vB5 supports it or not though. If not, it can be easily added.
            Nope, that's not a good solution as of today. It's only a working draft which many popular browsers, including IE 7.0 - 9.0, don't support. Others (including Safari) suffer from a buggy implementation requiring further hacks to make it work again. Until the HTML5 history API is widely and coherently adopted, you will need to either use a non-Ajax method for loading pages (recommended), or you'll have to implement common workarounds such as transforming the traditional anchor in a url, into a stateful hash (which works with any Javascript-enabled browser, but breaks when Javascript is disabled or not available).

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            • #51
              afaik, IE10 supports it. That means, IE10, chrome, firefox, safari (iOS) have full support. Enough reason not to butcher urls and anchors.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Riasat View Post
                afaik, IE10 supports it. That means, IE10, chrome, firefox, safari (iOS) have full support. Enough reason not to butcher urls and anchors.
                You make IE 10 your target browser? Seriously? What about all remaining IE users? Did I mention that HTML 5 history is working draft only? Did I mention that there are huge discrepancies in the implementation among different browsers? Instead, you talk about butchering URLs and ignore what everyone else has been doing.

                Just mind-blowing.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by AlexanderT View Post
                  You make IE 10 your target browser? Seriously? What about all remaining IE users? Did I mention that HTML 5 history is working draft only? Did I mention that there are huge discrepancies in the implementation among different browsers? Instead, you talk about butchering URLs and ignore what everyone else has been doing.

                  Just mind-blowing.
                  His personal browser. We actually don't even officially support IE10 at the moment. IE9 would be the Internet Explorer target at the moment though support for IE8 is looked at as well.
                  Translations provided by Google.

                  Wayne Luke
                  The Rabid Badger - a vBulletin Cloud customization and demonstration site.
                  vBulletin 5 Documentation - Updated every Friday. Report issues here.
                  vBulletin 5 API - Full / Mobile
                  I am not currently available for vB Messenger Chats.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    I'm a little late to this party, and some of this may have already been addressed. But I just have to say, loading up megabytes of JavaScript onto your PC and treating the browser as a thick client is the wrong direction of software development. I've seen other websites go this route and it has proved unpopular with customers who may not have bleeding edge hardware and a plentitude of RAM to try to execute this behemoth of client-side code.

                    AJAX is great for allowing quick changes of Settings, loading additional relevant information, or teasing branching content, but I feel it is a poor choice for core navigation. Overuse of Javascript harms accessibility and eliminates persistence upon suspend/resume and other energy-conservation device modes. When I reboot my computer after a Firefox update, all my browser tabs are reloaded right where I left them. Except vBulletin. All those will be rolled back to "page 1".

                    AJAX has its place, but you can get carried away. Have you tried phpMyAdmin lately? They rendered the browser BACK button completely useless. The most basic tasks now require many more clicks, and a lot longer waits for Javascript to render. phpMyAdmin took a huge step backward. I personally believe AJAX-centric websites are a fad that will die out like Flash splash/intro pages and Flash navigation bars.

                    Frankly, I find the responsiveness of vBulletin 5 to be abysmal. It's akin to browsing a website through Remote Desktop, GoToMyPC, pcAnywhere, Citrix, etc. on a dialup connection.

                    I wonder... Are all the great PHP programmers taken, so people are trying to ape the same functionality into JavaScript and treating PHP as a dumb data retrieval and transport protocol? PHP is capable of so much more.
                    Last edited by feldon23; Sat 22nd Sep '12, 12:06pm.

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                    • #55
                      I summed your post up into one sentance, which I happen to agree with.

                      Originally posted by feldon23 View Post
                      AJAX has its place, but you can get carried away.
                      Baby, I was born this way

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                      • #56
                        There is also a big difference when you load the homepage with and without javascript...

                        With javascript:

                        Click image for larger version

Name:	vbulletin_5_connect_with_javascript.png
Views:	2
Size:	210.1 KB
ID:	3690417

                        Without javascript:

                        Click image for larger version

Name:	vbulletin_5_connect_without_javascript.png
Views:	2
Size:	194.4 KB
ID:	3690418
                        - You can't see and navigate to forums!!!!!!!
                        - Announcements are not shown correctly

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                        • #57
                          ewwww
                          ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by querschlaeger View Post
                            There is also a big difference when you load the homepage with and without javascript...
                            Since its already been made clear it wont work without javascript, then Im not really sure why you expected otherwise ?
                            Baby, I was born this way

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Paul M View Post
                              Since its already been made clear it wont work without javascript, then Im not really sure why you expected otherwise ?
                              Will there be a notice for users with JavaScript disabled to let them know that the site won't work without it? Maybe a JavaScript notice?
                              Cliff
                              PathLabTalk
                              Square Wheels Cycling

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by dilbert View Post
                                Maybe a JavaScript notice?
                                How did you read my mind?

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