Please - Do not buy fur!

[Quillz]

In the United States, PETA adopts 80,000 animals a year from shelters and then puts them to sleep. While I agree with the message of not buying fur, I cannot endorse PETA.

My only thoughts on this is that if those 80,000 animals would have died in a more painful way, then perhaps it was for the best. It's sad, but there are just so many animals in this world to go unloved and unwanted.

[ChrisLM2001]

My only thoughts on this is that if those 80,000 animals would have died in a more painful way

They wouldn't have died, because there's enough people to take them in. The problem is two-fold: not enough neutering/spay/vaccination programs (taken a pet to a vet for "yearly" shots? $80 alone for the shots, tack on another $40+ for just visiting. Neutering and spaying is over $100 for a male pet now); and the kill/release the pets for any inconvienance mindset. One of the worst things to see at shelters (and along the road) is when folks dump their cute little kitten or puppy when they lost their cuteness. Happens everyday, everywhere, and that's no justification for putting them down.

The kindness of the human heart is so vast, that folks will take in even the terminally ill pets with chronic illnesses. If they can do that, there's a home and love for 80,000 pets with less problems.

[Wayne Luke]

My only thoughts on this is that if those 80,000 animals would have died in a more painful way, then perhaps it was for the best. It's sad, but there are just so many animals in this world to go unloved and unwanted.

Some of these adoptions happen at no-kill shelters as well. So it isn't overall for the best. The rescue that my wife works at no longer allows the adoption of the animals it rescues for this very reason. They are a no-kill rescue and have a full service hospital with all the latest technology to service the 1500 dogs, cats and horses on the 23 acre property. They do this with a budget of 2 million dollars a year and would expand as necessary to house animals. PETA has at least 30 million dollars a year but most of it is spent on television commercials, billboard campaigns, bail bonds and legal defense instead of actually providing homes for unwanted animals. If PETA truly thought what they were doing was just, it wouldn't be done in unmarked vans with the animals disposed of unlawfully in city garbage dumpsters.

http://www.targetofopportunity.com/PeTA.htm

[ComputerVitals]

Answer me this question:
Watch this video:

http://www.peta.org/feat/alicia_psa/index.asp

So how is that video helping to provide homes for animals?
With the Gore and sex that peta puts out, they should have movie ratings as well.

And for Animal Birth control? ABC

http://www.helpinganimals.com/f-dita-von-teese.asp

Why is is they have to sell it with Sex?

Kindof adds to Wayne's point.

[Reeve of Shinra]

I am 110% against animal cruelty and I feel that PETA is a truely misguided organization which does more harm than good for the cause.

[ChrisLM2001]

I am 110% against animal cruelty and I feel that PETA is a truely misguided organization which does more harm than good for the cause.

Yep. PETA has many "fan" sites as well...

http://www.petakillsanimals.com/

2) Despite its constant moralizing about the “unethical” treatment of animals by restaurant owners, grocers, farmers, scientists, anglers, and countless other Americans, PETA has killed over 14,400 dogs and cats at its Norfolk, Virginia headquarters. During 2005, PETA put to death over 90 percent of the animals it collected from members of the public.

Pet owners wake up to the truth. PETA only cares about itself, not animals -- especially PETS.

[Joe Gronlund]

Not to sound rude or anything.
But am i the only person in this thread that eats Steak??

[Wayne Luke]

But am i the only person in this thread that eats Steak??

My family eats meat two or three nights a week. However we only purchase organically grown meat. That means no beef and almost no pork until next year. Until then its mostly chicken, buffalo and maybe some rabbit if we can get it. We don't buy meat from factory farms but from friends who grow it for us. This year we have a pig, steer (half) and 2 turkeys being raised by friends. They aren't abused, get the best feed and are butchered humanely (less pain than a death row inmate). We buy the chicken and buffalo from local ranchers.

This doesn't take away that animals should be treated with respect either.

[Freesteyelz]

I hear you ChrisLM2001. I guess I have a different view than you and some of the others here of what terrorism is. I'm not an advocate for either side and really have no interest getting into this debate. I wanted to know the why more than anything and you've explained your position.

[Guest]

Not to sound rude or anything.
But am i the only person in this thread that eats Steak??

No, infact my family raises cows for the meat! But enough about that...!

I won't go into my hate for PETA... Some things do need to be said though; If some of the locals had the kind of money PETA burns through every year we'd be able to do a lot of good with it. I live in the "dog fighting capital of the world" so I'm sure you can imagine how bad it is around here.

[Wayne Luke]

I hear you ChrisLM2001. I guess I have a different view than you and some of the others here of what terrorism is. I'm not an advocate for either side and really have no interest getting into this debate. I wanted to know the why more than anything and you've explained your position.

What is your definition?

Here is what PETA's Vegan Campaign coordinator says:

"If we really believe that animals have the same right to be free from pain and suffering at our hands, then, of course, we're going to be blowing things up and smashing windows. For the record, I don't do this stuff, but I advocate it. I think it's a great way to bring about animal liberation, considering the level of suffering, the atrocities."

"I think it would be great if all of the fast-food outlets, slaughterhouses, these laboratories and the banks who fund them exploded tomorrow. I think it's perfectly appropriate for people to take bricks and toss them through windows. Hallelujah to the people who are willing to do it."
-- Bruce Friedrich, PeTA Campaign Director, Vegan Campaign Coordinator, Animal Rights 2001 Conference, July 2, 2001

[ComputerVitals]

mmmmm

Beef, It's whats for dinner

http://www.beefitswhatsfordinner.com/

[Freesteyelz]

What is your definition?

Criminal acts of violence or the promotion of violence that has the goal to intimidate and cause fear to the innocent(s).

As for Bruce Friedrich's quote, I've read it among others. I'm not impressed with his approach to animal rights, let alone his choice of language. He's one man, however, and I'm not sure if he speaks for the larger group. Has PETA lost it's way or did they have a hidden agenda from the onset of their conception? Are they just misunderstood? I really don't know.

Again, I view terrorism as criminal. Do I consider Bruce a terrorist or PETA a terrorist organization? Until they are classified as such I'll have my reservations.

[Businessservices]

There will always be issues like this knocking about, I guess it is a sad fact of life. I have no problem eating meat most people don't.

The fur issue is slightly different, I cannot say killing animals for the sake of it or for profit is ethical. Mind you if I lived in Alaska, I would have no problems killing an animal for a fur coat. In that respect people's opinions will always vary depending on their personal circumstances.

As for saying these PETA muppets are like terrorists, hmmm lol, having spent most of my adult life in the armed forces I would simply say there is no analogy at all. Terrorists are brainwashed cowards who threaten the very existence of our society, fighting them is a just cause and one I was more than happy to undertake. I find it very sad that people can be so easily manipulated into strapping on a Semtex jacket. I often ask myself, why are the leaders and hierarchy of these groups not blowing themselves up, if their cause is that just?

The trouble with these kind of debates is they go round in circles, also where is the line drawn. Many things we buy are tested on animals and we don't even realise it. You could say killing for fur is a terrible thing as you are frying up a nice beef steak with onions. I also don't go in for this organic meat crap, is it more humane to hand rear an animal and then kill it for meat, of course not.

These kind of things will always go on, it is a sad fact of life.

[ChrisLM2001]

Criminal acts of violence or the promotion of violence that has the goal to intimidate and cause fear to the innocent(s).

If you've seen the terror acts PETA has done, you would claim their terrorists by that definition, too.

They don't operate like true animal welfare associates. They prefer confiscating animals (if they don't have a facility to hold them, they prefer calling the local animal control to do the job -- not rescurers or an operator of a true "no kill" shelter). They'll protest enough to keep the pets in the pound, and if their evil enough, not allowing the pets to be rescued.

A couple years ago they, acting as "animal welfare advocates", went on a public campaign to terrorize a local vet who took the animal control director position. The problems at the animal control facility proceeded her, but that didn't matter, she was blamed for every problem at the facility. The result was she was literally terrorized and got death threats. The sheriff department had to watch her.

Having known that vet personally, and the kindness she showed to terminally ill pets (especially for owners who weren't ready to PTS their pet due to convienance), I knew first hand that the allegations were false. But these PETA types will not stop at reason, they are literally nuts -- issuing death threats; blaming her for every problem in the entire animal control arena; attacking her for putting asleep pets when other "no kill" facilities had no more room. The problem wasn't with her, it was the culture at the facility and the local politicians who neglected it. The result of all that warring, caused the very negligent politicians to adapt stricter rules on pet owners than even required on motor vehicles.

I'm all for animal welfare, but when the restrictions on pet owners on such things as how many pets you can have; how they can be vaccinated (because not every pet owner believes in vaccinating every year [except for rabies]. With cats there's a serious issue with injection site sarcomas [cancer], and why vets themself can and do recommend 3 year vaccinations, not yearly); and how abuse investigations are handled -- it has gone too far.

Your opinion is your opinion, but those who've seen PETA and their militant followers in action face-to-face, it's no longer a opinion -- it's a fact.