vBulletin 3.0.0 Beta 7 Released - Discuss

[Kier]

Discuss away! :)

If you are having a specific problem, please post in the appropriate forum rather than using this thread. If you believe that your problem is the result of a bug, please use the vBulletin 3 bug tracker (http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/bugs.php?).

[Daniel P]

Wee I'm going to download it right now :)
Thank you for the update!

[cirisme]

Discuss away! :)

If you are having a specific problem, please post in the appropriate forum rather than using this thread. If you believe that your problem is the result of a bug, please use the vBulletin 3 bug tracker (http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/bugs.php?).
Cool!

[TheComputerGuy]

Wow...they released this baby a day early!

Can't wait for all the bugs to be smashed

[qxh]

Wow...they released this baby a day early!

Can't wait for all the bugs to be smashed

Wow I wasn't expecting this, good work guys!!

[Scott MacVicar]

Wow...they released this baby a day early!

Can't wait for all the bugs to be smashed
we really released it 2 days late ;)

[Daniel P]

Really Scott ? I didn't notice that until you said it :) Really ^__^

[John Round]

This will be the last beta before RC, right? ;)

[Kier]

The original plan was to release it on Monday, but that didn't happen for various reasons I won't go into...

[Scott MacVicar]

Should be.

As i've said elsewhere the style is going to take a bit to develop and we felt that it would be better to release another beta and let testing continue rather than waiting a few extra weeks until a style is done.

[Ryan Ashbrook]

I really wish that RC would be out soon but I also don't want the vB team to overwork themselves. ;)

Great job on vB3, I love it.

[Daniel P]

Yea Scott you're right there. Better a Beta 8 and then concentrate ONLY on the style and all so it looks good.

[John Round]

A few extra weeks :eek: (In a good way, Seems the style must be coming on pretty quick there ;))

[Breaker]

i no longer feel the need 2 update, i'll wait til rc or final until i upgrade again

[rylin]

Any chance of a screenie from the current style-in-progress?
(Anything to please the masses! :D)

[M1th]

Any chance of a screenie from the current style-in-progress?
(Anything to please the masses! :D)
ditto! Please?!? :D

[qxh]

ditto! Please?!? :D
^^ ;)

[subduck]

I can't wait to see the new style :D

[Hurricane_GS]

I would rather see them use the couple of minutes they would spend posting a screen shot on actually writing the style. You will all see it when it is released. Just relax. :)

[RGSerge]

I am waiting for the RC, we have a template intensive site, so this will be pain, then pain again on RC.

One Pain is ok, but two... neah :D

Waits patiently :D

[freaky]

ditto! Please?!? :D
tritto!!!
Give us a screenshot if possible :D

[P.Jackson]

damn shame my licence just ran out :( looks like ill have to renew licence $30 :'( ow well it can wait until next week

[Buczilla]

hooray, i'm on the second page :D

[Weasel]

For those of us with beta 7 preview...do we need to upload any files or run and scripts? or just do the xml/query stuff?

[Ryan Ashbrook]

According to the announcement all you need to do is run the XML and query.

[AZone]

Ooops! Surprise! :)
Downloading....

[Ogden2k]

I like how the images are much more organized now!

[snyx]

meh, I would just like to know if it will released with the first RC or Final?

[Wayne Luke]

meh, I would just like to know if it will released with the first RC or Final?
Know if what will be released with RC or Final? The style? If so, it has been said since Beta 3 that the style will be released with the RC.

[Angry Coder]

Will vBulletin change it's default style (the way it looks)?!

What I thought is changing templates name, etc! :)

[snyx]

sorry luke, I dont keep up much around here anymore.

thanks.

[Snowy]

cheers guys :) good job

[Ogden2k]

One thing that would be helpful is in the Image Paths section where you can specify image paths, in the description it would be nice to see what the call is for it, like $stylevar[imgdir_button]/. What do you think devs?

[Zachery]

hover over the text box some time ;)

[Faruk]

hover over the text box some time ;)
+And make sure you're running in debug mode if you don't get it (though in that section, you SHOULD get it regardless of debug, I think)

[Zachery]

yes you will... i told you that in the chat! its a standard feature :P

[centris]

Upgrade was smooth, like the new image folders. Does anyone else think the index page is loading faster under IE??

Q. Will the new Graphics development kit be released at the same time as RC1?

[Ian Gordon]

Good you know your on top of the ball game. Can't wait for RC1.

[Maverick1236]

Good you know your on top of the ball game. Can't wait for RC1.
GREAT job on beta 7

nicely done

cheers :cool:

[bgoodman]

upgrade went smoothly

[Angry Coder]

Will I loose any of my style customization if I upgrade from beta 6 to beta 7?

[EdmundTan]

upgrade went smoothlyUpgrading was definitely not smooth for us. As we do not use the default image folder (ours is in another sub-folder under the default), we had massive path problems. And the change in the var name for the image folder made it worse. :mad:

As I did not manage to read any msg on the change in the var names (I must have missed it somewhere?), it took a while to figure out that it was the change in the names that caused the fall-over.

[Lumina]

Was template showthread_ratingdisplay removed for Beta 7 ? Can I delete it ?

[edit: ok, yes, I can remove it]

[Wayne Luke]

Upgrading was definitely not smooth for us. As we do not use the default image folder (ours is in another sub-folder under the default), we had massive path problems. And the change in the var name for the image folder made it worse. :mad:

As I did not manage to read any msg on the change in the var names (I must have missed it somewhere?), it took a while to figure out that it was the change in the names that caused the fall-over.
http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/showthread.php?t=83524

http://www.vbulletin.com/vbdocs/vb3b7_images.html

Both provided in the Announcement forum, your major source of information about Beta releases.

[cyclical]

do we have to revert the templates again?

[Rein Masamuri]

Props guys :up:
Can't wait to see the new style!
(perhaps a button? kidding kidding...)

[jluerken]

I think to release more betas and give it a little bit of extra time is better as releasing an RC and getting flamed because of found bugs.

Testing testing testing and then a release. Keep in mind that many users are using their vB in a professionell environment and not as a fun board :D

If an RC is coming out I want this to have no known bugs left. I hate Boards where you have to update every two weeks :D

[TonyG]

Can't wait for the RC. Great work. :)

[Ogden2k]

hover over the text box some time ;)
Ahh yes, that works good!

[PBChannel]

So, does this mean that work on the CMS will continue soon? :D

[pablo]

http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/images/misc/vb_bullet.gif is this new ? or is my mind going ?

[poolking]

http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/images/misc/vb_bullet.gif is this new ? or is my mind going ?
The devs mentioned something about a bug icon they use, so they had to change the temp buttons.

[GamerzWorld]

When is the planned date for RC or isnt there one ?

[Rici]

If an RC is coming out I want this to have no known bugs left. I hate Boards where you have to update every two weeks :D You shouldn´t forget: a RC isn´t a Final... the RC mustn´t be completyle bug free - after all it would be great ;)

[Zachery]

Gamerz every time a person ask they push it back 2 weeks :)

[poolking]

You shouldn´t forget: a RC isn´t a Final... the RC mustn´t be completyle bug free - after all it would be great ;)
What gives you the idea that an RC musn't be completely bug free?

[Rici]

What gives you the idea that an RC musn't be completely bug free? If it were completly bug free it would be a final ;)

[poolking]

If it were completly bug free it would be a final ;)
Not necessarily, a developer could decide that something needs tweaking, for example the look of something before they decide to go gold.

[todd.o.callen]

I just want to register my IMMENSE displeasure at yet another beta version and another one in the works. I rue the day I ever considered using vBulletin for professional purposes. I have mentioned in the past, I am now nearly six months behind initial projections on a major new project, all because vB 3 has become such a massive elephant. Good grief, release the core functions and have language module releases for those few people who actually need them. I couldn't care less about styles either. My main needs are for:

1) the attachments as files hack
2) the ability for a user to be in multiple groups
3) multiple attachments for a single post

The rest, for my corporate needs, is either icing or crap. Timing is FAR more important than Swahili written right to left on a metallic background that can be changed based on mood or chat preference. Add the icing later before the cake spoils. I have at least 5 licenses in the balance (no big deal to you guys, I know), but 2003 will be a year long remembered by me as the year that Jelsoft failed its customers. This many betas show that Jelsoft is either severely understaffed or poorly managed.

I hate to flame, and I used to really love the product and the community, but the fabled vB3 has become a Holy Grail that has destroyed a lot of trust, and there is no end in sight. Some day you will have a dynamite product, hopefully, but a lot of damage is being done in the mean time. My answer to those who will remind me that no promises were ever made is to get real. My answer to those who are willing to wait forever to get the perfect, fully-loaded product is that they must not really need the enhancements.


My $.02, but my patience is gone.

[Ryan Ashbrook]

I just want to register my IMMENSE displeasure at yet another beta version and another one in the works. I rue the day I ever considered using vBulletin for professional purposes. I have mentioned in the past, I am now nearly six months behind initial projections on a major new project, all because vB 3 has become such a massive elephant. Good grief, release the core functions and have language module releases for those few people who actually need them. I couldn't care less about styles either. My main needs are for:

1) the attachments as files hack
2) the ability for a user to be in multiple groups
3) multiple attachments for a single post

The rest, for my corporate needs, is either icing or crap. Timing is FAR more important than Swahili written right to left on a metallic background that can be changed based on mood or chat preference. Add the icing later before the cake spoils. I have at least 5 licenses in the balance (no big deal to you guys, I know), but 2003 will be a year long remembered by me as the year that Jelsoft failed its customers. This many betas show that Jelsoft is either severely understaffed or poorly managed.

I hate to flame, and I used to really love the product and the community, but the fabled vB3 has become a Holy Grail that has destroyed a lot of trust, and there is no end in sight. Some day you will have a dynamite product, hopefully, but a lot of damage is being done in the mean time. My answer to those who will remind me that no promises were ever made is to get real. My answer to those who are willing to wait forever to get the perfect, fully-loaded product is that they must not really need the enhancements.


My $.02, but my patience is gone.
At least they tried, and tried hard.

I, for one, am completely satisfied with vBulletin 3, I may not hack it at all when vBulletin.org is allowed to release hacks for it.

I congratulate the vB dev's for the immense hours they've spent to make this product better than it already is.

[Wayne Luke]

do we have to revert the templates again?
You have to revert templates listed in the announcement and most likely will have to revert the entire template set when the RC is released.

[todd.o.callen]

At least they tried, and tried hard.

I, for one, am completely satisfied with vBulletin 3, I may not hack it at all when vBulletin.org is allowed to release hacks for it.

I congratulate the vB dev's for the immense hours they've spent to make this product better than it already is.
Granted. I know they bit off a lot and are working hard.

[M1th]

Gamerz every time a person ask they push it back 2 weeks :)
... plus, one kitty is killed :( :rolleyes:

[PBChannel]

I just want to register my IMMENSE displeasure at yet another beta version and another one in the works. I rue the day I ever considered using vBulletin for professional purposes. I have mentioned in the past, I am now nearly six months behind initial projections on a major new project, all because vB 3 has become such a massive elephant. Good grief, release the core functions and have language module releases for those few people who actually need them. I couldn't care less about styles either. My main needs are for:

The rest, for my corporate needs, is either icing or crap. Timing is FAR more important than Swahili written right to left on a metallic background that can be changed based on mood or chat preference. Add the icing later before the cake spoils. I have at least 5 licenses in the balance (no big deal to you guys, I know), but 2003 will be a year long remembered by me as the year that Jelsoft failed its customers. This many betas show that Jelsoft is either severely understaffed or poorly managed.

I hate to flame, and I used to really love the product and the community, but the fabled vB3 has become a Holy Grail that has destroyed a lot of trust, and there is no end in sight. Some day you will have a dynamite product, hopefully, but a lot of damage is being done in the mean time. My answer to those who will remind me that no promises were ever made is to get real. My answer to those who are willing to wait forever to get the perfect, fully-loaded product is that they must not really need the enhancements.


My $.02, but my patience is gone.Perhaps you should have outsourced your needs instead of waiting on vBulletin?

vBulletin is written for the masses, just like Windows is written for the masses. Microsoft isn't going to release the next version of windows just because you're behind on your projections.

1) the attachments as files hack
2) the ability for a user to be in multiple groups
3) multiple attachments for a single postThis can easily be done with the current version of vBulletin, if you know of or are a programmer.

Additionally, there are MANY other options out there -- phpBB, Invision Power Board, Ultimate Bulletin Board, Ikonboard, .... You probably should have looked at them instead of "waiting six months" for vB3.

Now, if you were paying Jelsoft to write vB3 for you, that would be another story. But, you aren't. So, buck up and stop blaming Jelsoft.

[todd.o.callen]

Perhaps you should have outsourced your needs instead of waiting on vBulletin?

vBulletin is written for the masses, just like Windows is written for the masses. Microsoft isn't going to release the next version of windows just because you're behind on your projections.

I think it's pretty clear that Microsoft doesn't delay realeases for any reason, even good reasons. :rolleyes: The key to programming for the masses is keeping users as homogenous as possible, in terms of deployment versions. The more people have to hack their boards, the harder it is for JelSoft to release vanilla upgrades that can be installed transparently. The strategic key will be for the core product to include enough functionality for most people not to have to hack. This will reduce the resistance to additional modules being released on a more regular basis. With more people running essentially vanilla boards, the developers won't have to worry so much about stepping on hacks when they develop new features.

My guess is that vB3 is intended to be a major level setter that will reduce the widespread need for hacks. That's the path to acceptance in the non-casual market where I live. That's also where the real money is if you can get established.

Nobody wants to have to jump vendors, and hacking is not the answer, nor is it really in JelSoft's best interests except for using hacks as a test environment for future feature releases. I think JelSoft is trying to upgrade itself into a stronger market presence with a broader base. I think that this direction is smart, but it's also really hurting those of us who really need it to happen.

If I had had ANY inkling that I would be left at the altar for six months, I probably would have started shopping, but I fell for the week-by-week optimism that has been peddled here. In a sense, the license fees do pay for vB 3 development, but Microsoft's approach would be to make us buy the new version outright. Point taken.

[dynamite]

I think it's pretty clear that Microsoft doesn't delay realeases for any reason, even good reasons. :rolleyes: Exactly... and that's the reason we are running into the problems were are now. If people take the time and fix it right the first time, then that cuts out a lot of the headaches in the long run. I understand the frustration, I was like that before vB3 came out, but I think everyone at Jelsoft has been working really hard to get this to a RC, and it has been well worth the wait!

[RobAC]

todd.o.callen:

1. Pull yourself down from your high and mighty pedestal...

2. You made the grave error of basing your "initial projections" on a piece of beta software and the assumed time to production of the product. You have nobody else to blame but yourself here. End of story.

[todd.o.callen]

todd.o.callen:

1. Pull yourself down from your high and mighty pedestal...

2. You made the grave error of basing your "initial projections" on a piece of beta software and the assumed time to production of the product. You have nobody else to blame but yourself here. End of story.
Sorry for the tone. I'm done complaining for this Beta.

[Snowy]

todd.o.callen

Im sorry but you bore the living F*** out of me, all you do is rant and rant. If you based it ALL on a BETA version then you have noone to blame but yourself. I mean common be serious here its a BETA version that HAS to go through testing or you as a customer would be the first to complain if it was released with bugs that the dev team knew were there. Maybe for once if its not to hard for you give the dev team some thanks for fully testing it before releasing it as a finished package ? :)

[Rocky_BBQ]

Maybe Jelsoft shouldn't even make any beta versions available to the public.

I know that this is a good way to find bugs faster, but by doing this, the public expects the final release faster.

I think they should not make anything available to the general public until it is final. Then there would not be all this constant complaining.

Jelsoft can use a few hundred designated beta testers, but nobody else should have access to betas.

[Rici]

I think they should not make anything available to the general public until it is final. Then there would not be all this constant complaining. Let em shout and cry... it´s none of the dev´s buisness! I think the public beta is okay for testing and bugfixing after all.

[Wayne Luke]

People are entitled to their opinions. Let's keep the discussion about the opinions and not attack the person directly please. I would hate to have to close this thread.

[Snowy]

Let em shout and cry... it´s none of the dev´s buisness! I think the public beta is okay for testing and bugfixing after all.
I agree, and they do state that its a beta and shouldnt be used on a live forum, so if you do and encounter problems then you only have yourselfs to blame.

[Snowy]

People are entitled to their opinions. Let's keep the discussion about the opinions and not attack the person directly please. I would hate to have to close this thread.
I appologise but it seems all that bloke can do is complain and then some......

I didnt mean to personally attack anyone, just stating my opinion that he bores me as all he does it rant about the same thing in every release thread.

[UHN_ED]

I think it's pretty clear that Microsoft doesn't delay realeases for any reason, even good reasons. :rolleyes: The key to programming for the masses is keeping users as homogenous as possible, in terms of deployment versions. The more people have to hack their boards, the harder it is for JelSoft to release vanilla upgrades that can be installed transparently. The strategic key will be for the core product to include enough functionality for most people not to have to hack. This will reduce the resistance to additional modules being released on a more regular basis. With more people running essentially vanilla boards, the developers won't have to worry so much about stepping on hacks when they develop new features.

My guess is that vB3 is intended to be a major level setter that will reduce the widespread need for hacks. That's the path to acceptance in the non-casual market where I live. That's also where the real money is if you can get established.

Nobody wants to have to jump vendors, and hacking is not the answer, nor is it really in JelSoft's best interests except for using hacks as a test environment for future feature releases. I think JelSoft is trying to upgrade itself into a stronger market presence with a broader base. I think that this direction is smart, but it's also really hurting those of us who really need it to happen.

If I had had ANY inkling that I would be left at the altar for six months, I probably would have started shopping, but I fell for the week-by-week optimism that has been peddled here. In a sense, the license fees do pay for vB 3 development, but Microsoft's approach would be to make us buy the new version outright. Point taken.
You want it to have so mant features that people will have no need for hacks, yet you want it developed in a short time.

You sound just as bad as that guy who complained about the code not being exactly the same so all his hacks broke, but still wanted new features along with the no change in code...:rolleyes:

[Faruk]

I rue the day I ever considered using vBulletin for professional purposes.

Yes, rue the day you actually thought that a company that doesn't want to release bug-ridden products as a major new release was a bad day in your astonishingly perfect life filled with perfect choices you've made everywhere.

I don't recall anyone at Jelsoft ever saying vB3 would be finished in the early months of this year. They were HOPING to get it done, but that does not equal them telling you "you'll be able to use vB3 in June as a final product".

You have no one but yourself to blame for this, really.
If you had such important projects to finish in time, you shouldn't have decided to go for something that was still heavily in development stages. Simple as that.

[PBChannel]

We're not attacking him, we're defending Jelsoft. :D

But, yes, I agree, this is supposed to be a discussion about Beta 7, not why it hasn't gone gold yet. We've slipped off topic.

[Cyborg from DH]

Development is moving along smoothly. Beta 7 seems pretty good, RC1 should be even better.

[Faruk]

to Kier:

in your announcement:

# text-alignment: left => text-alignment: $stylevar[left]

should be:
text-align:

(text-alignment: is not css)

[squall14716]

The more people have to hack their boards, the harder it is for JelSoft to release vanilla upgrades that can be installed transparently. The strategic key will be for the core product to include enough functionality for most people not to have to hack.
I don't have to hack, I do it because I enjoy customizing vBulletin. vB3 isn't going to come with some Store, Arcade, RPG, or Now Playing ****, and it shouldn't come with it either. Not to mention the joys of installing TomBot and torturing the little piggy. :p

[GamerzWorld]

There must be a sort of time scale. A week, 2 a month or 2 a year or 2 :p

[Rici]

There must be a sort of time scale. A week, 2 a month or 2 a year or 2 :p Think of 3 years from now on... you won´t be disappointed that way! :D

[Toky0]

Have paitience. The RC will be out soon.

EDIT: Upgrade went smoothly. =P

[Hyper22Shadow]

w00t, can't wait till RC ^_^

[clangrounds.com]

Is there anyway for you to post a list of what changed template wise for us impatient buggers who modified their boards? That way we can just go in and change what needs to be changed so we can get our forumhome icons back for example... :)

[AboutMe]

Where can i download vbulle?

[Vile]

Where can i download vbulle?


Download it from the members area:

http://www.vbulletin.com/members/

[Zachery]

granted you bought your license :)

which is 160 for an owned or 85 ayear for leased

www.vbulletin.com/order.php (http://www.vbulletin.com/order.php)
:)

[Erwin]

Has anyone else noticed an increase in server loads since upgrading to Beta 7?

[Zachery]

not really :\

[nkoo1]

This release is really none sense since it 's a pain in the ass with the images reorganized and after upgrade from beta6 - beta7. Broken images is still everywhere and look into the path forum/images2/blabla...
what the h...images2 doing in here....
I gave up upgrading. The more you guys tried to fix it the more problem become.....


I am very disappointed with you guys on the release.

[Erwin]

Has anyone else noticed an increase in server loads since upgrading to Beta 7?
Mmm... maybe it's just me then. Really, my server loads are much higher. Time to figure out why. I've already tried a server reboot.

[Erwin]

This release is really none sense since it 's a pain in the ass with the images reorganized and after upgrade from beta6 - beta7. Broken images is still everywhere and look into the path forum/images2/blabla...
what the h...images2 doing in here....
I gave up upgrading. The more you guys tried to fix it the more problem become.....


I am very disappointed with you guys on the release.Did you read the upgrade instructions BEFORE upgrading? It tells you how to prepare for it and fix the image problems.

A tip: You can always go to Admin CP, Style, Edit, and make all the image paths the same as before. Instant fix.

[AboutMe]

Download it from the members area:

http://www.vbulletin.com/members/
I can't join member area. So can you show me somewhere other to download it ?

[MrNase]

Why can't you join member area? Didn't you buy a license?

[poolking]

I can't join member area. So can you show me somewhere other to download it ?
There is no where else you can download it.

Have you bought a licence?

If you have bought a licence you will have to enter your customer number and password that came with the e-mail from jelsoft when you bought your licence.

The once you've done that visit here to add your e-mail address:

http://www.vbulletin.com/members/forums.php

No one will help you further until you've done that.

[JAWilliams]

there is no where else - you need to purchase a licence, wait for the payment to go through and then download it from there

[AboutMe]

Why can't you join member area? Didn't you buy a license?
Where can i buy license?

[poolking]

Where can i buy license?
http://www.vbulletin.com/order/

[DarkDelight.net]

Where can i buy license?http://www.vbulletin.com/order

[DarkDelight.net]

http://www.vbulletin.com/order/
Damn 60 second limit.

Grrr :p

[poolking]

http://www.vbulletin.com/order.php
Oi, I posted that before you. :p

[DarkDelight.net]

Oi, I posted that before you. :p
I say again....


...Damn 60 second limit.

Grrr :p

[Zachery]

i told him that one page ago

:rollseyes: :P

[DarkDelight.net]

i told him that one page ago

:rollseyes: :P
LOL :D

You should know by now, no one reads anything before the last page. :p

[Zachery]

true but i said it first :D :P

[AboutMe]

Thanks verry much ;)

[DarkDelight.net]

Thanks verry much ;)So, are you going to be a good little boy and cough up or what?

j/k

vB really is worth every penny.

[Scott MacVicar]

Erwin any idea what is increasing load?

mysqld process or httpd process?

[AboutMe]

So, are you going to be a good little boy and cough up or what?

j/k

vB really is worth every penny.
hahahah Dark :D i don't mean to be going anything but myself!But i need to setup vbulletin for my forum!

[qxh]

AboutMe: After you have purchaced a license you will have access to download and setup vbulletin legally.

[AboutMe]

AboutMe: After you have purchaced a license you will have access to download and setup vbulletin legally.
I known but i haven't got a visa yet :(

[qxh]

You can also pay by PayPal or Offline Methords (such as Cheques).

[Kier]

to Kier:

in your announcement:

# text-alignment: left => text-alignment: $stylevar[left]

should be:
text-align:

(text-alignment: is not css)
Oops, yeah ;)

The actual templates have the correct CSS, it was just a typo in the announcement (which I will now go and correct)

[qxh]

Kier whilst you're here, any news on what we discussed in IRC?

[Kier]

Kier whilst you're here, any news on what we discussed in IRC?
... which was?

[qxh]

... which was?
LOL pm'd

[poolking]

Kier whilst you're here, any news on what we discussed in IRC?
Now you've done it, let rumours flow. ;) :D

[qxh]

LOL :p

[DarkDelight.net]

Now you've done it, let rumours flow. ;) :D
You know, this really got my hopes up... and I haven no idea what about.

[Pilot]

VB3 is taking forever in order to add obscure features that will interest only a minority. As a long term customer I am getting bored of waiting.

The number of new features (in English like this board) that come out of the box without template editing and hacking is what counts for most people (who are not the ones that necessarily spend all day posting here).

[Zachery]

VB3 is taking forever in order to add obscure features that will interest only a minority. As a long term customer I am getting bored of waiting.

The number of new features (in English like this board) that come out of the box without template editing and hacking is what counts for most people (who are not the ones that necessarily spend all day posting here).
what ever are you talking about? what obsecure features?

they added the ones everyone demaned ;)

[Faruk]

VB3 is taking forever in order to add obscure features that will interest only a minority. As a long term customer I am getting bored of waiting.

The number of new features (in English like this board) that come out of the box without template editing and hacking is what counts for most people (who are not the ones that necessarily spend all day posting here).
There's only one such feature that I can think of that fits your description, and that's the spellchecker. The rest is quite what everyone, or at least the majority, needs and wants.

So :p to you

[Zachery]

personally i dont care either way :\

:) it might help several of the users on some of my sites :)

[poolking]

Pilot - List the obscure features.

[Littlebit]

ahhh...the ever so wanted spellchecker. I had blocked out the need for this sometime ago....thanks kurafire! for putting it back into my head :p:rolleyes: :sigh:::
:)

[neo|d3fx]

I would love to see a spellchecker for vBulletin. Especially since one of my administrators has a problem spelling even simple words. :)

[FileJune]

I would love to see a spellchecker for vBulletin. Especially since one of my administrators has a problem spelling even simple words. :)
yes a spell checker will come in handy
/me rapes jeff for bringing me into this
lol

[squall14716]

VB3 is taking forever in order to add obscure features that will interest only a minority. As a long term customer I am getting bored of waiting.

The number of new features (in English like this board) that come out of the box without template editing and hacking is what counts for most people (who are not the ones that necessarily spend all day posting here).
The only feature the only interests a minority was the threaded mode IMO. And even with that said, vB3 is better coded than vB2 - uses less queries and doesn't register the globals. vB3 >>>>> vB2.

[Chroder]

There :) Downlaoded and upgraded. Getting all my images for my custom template was hell - but at lease I didnt have to redo everything.

[Zachery]

i found it ezier to revert my templates and re-edit them :)

[Pilot]

Multi-language support for one thing. Internationalisation can wait.

[Chris Blount]

There is a free spellchecker available that works with VB3 that requires no hacking. It's a Perl script that runs on the server and uses ISPELL or ASPELL libraries with a small modification to a few templates. Very easy to install and works great!

http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthread.php?t=37398&highlight=spell+check

[Rici]

Multi-language support for one thing. Internationalisation can wait. Oh, just because you don´t need it, it´s not necessary! Great idea, boy!

[poolking]

Multi-language support for one thing. Internationalisation can wait.
Great idea, alienate the other countries who's first language isn't English, not good business practice is it?

[Wayne Luke]

Multi-language support for one thing. Internationalisation can wait.
It might be able to wait for you. However we have literally thousands of International Customers asking, actually demanding this. Some customers are required by law to provide multiple languages in order to use the software as well.

Internationalization is not a trivial feature. It is necessary for further growth of the software.

[mtha]

Multi-language support for one thing. Internationalisation can wait. It might be able to wait for you. However we have literally thousands of International Customers asking, actually demanding this. Some customers are required by law to provide multiple languages in order to use the software as well.

Internationalization is not a trivial feature. It is necessary for further growth of the software.sorry for the stupid question, but what's the different between "multi language support" and "internationalization"?

if you can support different languages, means international people can read your board in their language, it also means your board is broaden international, kind of. Am I missing something here?


btw, is there a variable to call in browser to change display language (using languageid, just like styleid? something like: http://www.yourdomain.com/forums/index.php?styleid=1&languageid=1

[ccrfan]

It might be able to wait for you. However we have literally thousands of International Customers asking, actually demanding this. Some customers are required by law to provide multiple languages in order to use the software as well.

Internationalization is not a trivial feature. It is necessary for further growth of the software.


this would be a great feature for when i buy my VB license. since my site is aiming to viewers all over the world.

[Wayne Luke]

sorry for the stupid question, but what's the different between "multi language support" and "internationalization"?

if you can support different languages, means international people can read your board in their language, it also means your board is broaden international, kind of. Am I missing something here?


btw, is there a variable to call in browser to change display language (using languageid, just like styleid? something like: http://www.yourdomain.com/forums/index.php?styleid=1&languageid=1 There isn't a difference... vBulletin 2.X does not support multiple languages easily which is why it is being added to 3.0

I don't think there is a variable. It is changeable in the user's profile.

[Erwin]

Erwin any idea what is increasing load?

mysqld process or httpd process?
httpd process, using up to 99.99% of CPU. Very strange - if you look at the MRTG graphs, it's very obvious.

I'll attach the graph here:

I upgraded to Beta 7 on Friday night. Note the jump in server loads.

[Stryker]

My upgrade went very smoothly. If your images fail to show up after the upgrade remember to revert your custom templates and refresh the pages.

[Scott MacVicar]

httpd process, using up to 99.99% of CPU. Very strange - if you look at the MRTG graphs, it's very obvious.

I'll attach the graph here:

I upgraded to Beta 7 on Friday night. Note the jump in server loads.
any part of the site seeming slower?

Posting, Subscribing, AdminCP etc

[Erwin]

any part of the site seeming slower?

Posting, Subscribing, AdminCP etc
Not really. Overall the site works pretty well. I've changed Apache and MySQL settings. I shall wait till peak times and see if that made a difference. A server reboot didn't help.

[Chris Blount]

Just upgraded to Beta 7 and it went pretty well. Had to revert a couple of templates and move some graphics around but no biggy.

The only thing that bothers me is the speed decrease. Ever since I upgraded to Beta 6 my site has slowed down especially when loading threads (showthread). It take a few seconds longer to load them.

[MrNase]

even on my local system i notice a speed decrease :(

I kept my mouth shut because i didn't optimize my configs and I tought this would be the problem but now i see that different people have the same problem. Now you (devs ;)) should find out why beta7 loads slower as beta6.
If someone on a local system notices that the forums load one second slower, what do the others notice (running this software on a shared host)?
Did the numbers of queries increase? Or what's going on?

[M1th]

Just upgraded to Beta 7 and it went pretty well. Had to revert a couple of templates and move some graphics around but no biggy.

The only thing that bothers me is the speed decrease. Ever since I upgraded to Beta 6 my site has slowed down especially when loading threads (showthread). It take a few seconds longer to load them. sadly, its the same for me. :/


Beta 5 was waay faster than the 6 and 7. :confused:


I'm starting to wonder whether the server optimization settings in vB are not working...

[Wayne Luke]

As a test, turn off the WYSIWYG editor and see if the speed improves.

[MJM]

I too have noticed a gradual sluggishness in performance viewing these forums with each successive upgrade.
I had thought it might be because of the size of these forums, but I see others are also experiencing this problem on their sites.
My vb2.3 is working beautifully, and, not knowing much about the technical aspects, I presumed it is because it is still a small (but growing) site, that I do not allow attachments/images/avatars nor signatures, and I've kept the forums depth very low. (I have a separate but integrated images gallery because I did not want to be overly presumtuous that vB could serve ALL my needs).

I was hoping to upgrade to the latest vBeta7 from vB2.3 this weekend, primarily to be able to offer our membership the `read post in email notification' (which is quite frankly, a faster way of reading messages than any web-based application) for our time-strapped membership, but I will hold on to sweet bippy until this performance glitch can be clarified, and hopefully resolved.

Mark
...crosses fingers knees and toes, wishing upon a star so bright, that vB3 will come out alright

[MJM]

"As a test, turn off the WYSIWYG editor and see if the speed improves"

possibly a slight improvement with the above turned off, but I need to get back to work, and will let others with more technical knowledge tackle this.
best wishes
Mark

[Chris Blount]

As a test, turn off the WYSIWYG editor and see if the speed improves.No difference in speed.

[poolking]

I've just had to turn mine off as well and it has speeded up greatly since I did.

[vBadvanced]

http://plurplanet.com/forum/showthread.php?p=506226#post506226

Page generated in 37.61 seconds... Granted there are 30,000 replies to the thread, but it never took more than 3-4 seconds to load with vBulletin 2.x...

[Wayne Luke]

Took less than ten second for me. What is the difference?

[vBadvanced]

Weird... I refreshed the page a couple of times this morning and couldn't get much better than 30 seconds or so. Seems to be loading in about 2 - 6 seconds now. I don't think my server load was high or there was anything else going on that would affect it... Oh well, I guess I was wrong. :)

[Scott MacVicar]

its MySQL Query cache to the rescue most likely.

I think any thread with 30,000 posts is going to cause problems.
If you could turn on debug and go to the thread with &explain=1 in the URL and save the results and email to scott@vbulletin.com it would be pretty useful.

[Rynthar]

Plurplanet, what portal do you use that works with VB3? Like what powers that homepage?

[vBadvanced]

It's my own (mYvBindex). It will be available for vB3 at vBulletin.org once vBulletin 3 RC is released. ;)



Plurplanet, what portal do you use that works with VB3? Like what powers that homepage?

[Rynthar]

Argh, so I cant get it now? Really need it, anyway I can work something out with you?

[vBadvanced]

its MySQL Query cache to the rescue most likely.


I think any thread with 30,000 posts is going to cause problems.
If you could turn on debug and go to the thread with &explain=1 in the URL and save the results and email to scott@vbulletin.com it would be pretty useful.Is that the same as the post cache feature of vB3, or something else? I'm aware of the post cache which is why I tried refreshing the page a few times to make sure the number was accurate. Either way, it seems ok now, so there may have been something up with the server that I was unaware of.
I'll email you the results in just a second. ;)

By the way... Did someone from here happen to log into my site using a test account? I just noticed that someone was logged in from the test account I use, which I thought was pretty strange...

[Rynthar]

Plurp, would you mind getting on AIM? would love to pick your brain about your site, promise i wont ask for the software =)

[vBadvanced]

Sorry, I don't really use AIM except for when I'm at work... You may feel free to email me at brian@plurplanet.com though. :)

[Scott MacVicar]

I looked at the query and your scanning 39, 000 rows which i thought was odd.

I went back and looked at the thread and realised it was a big word game thread, row scanning we can't really do anything about.

Building the threadids we might though so i'll look at that.

[MJM]

Turned the WYSIWYG back on, as a test, and whatever the techs are doing here, performance speed in the forums seems to be on the up n up.
thanks!
Mark

[Erwin]

As a test, turn off the WYSIWYG editor and see if the speed improves.
If you were referring to me as well, my forum speed is no problem since I use a Dual Xeon with 2 Gb RAM - it's just that the server loads are hitting 10 when using Beta 6 it never went above 4 with the same amount of traffic (actually, less since it's the weekend). Strange, but true. I've tried to optimize apache and mysql, with no difference.

[Wayne Luke]

If you were referring to me as well, my forum speed is no problem since I use a Dual Xeon with 2 Gb RAM - it's just that the server loads are hitting 10 when using Beta 6 it never went above 4 with the same amount of traffic (actually, less since it's the weekend). Strange, but true. I've tried to optimize apache and mysql, with no difference.
I was referring to the people who said that Beta 6 and 7 have slower showthreads displays than Beta 5 did.

[CricketWeb]

Is it actually possible to upgrade from VBulletin 2.3.2 to Beta 7? It isn't possible to upgrade from 2.3.2 to Beta 6 - you get all sorts of errors which I listed in the troubleshooting thread.

[Toky0]

I upgraded from 2.3.0 to beta 6 and had no problem.

[Zachery]

i dont see why thered be a problem with 6 :\

[Rynthar]

Something is wrong with the Installer Faranth

[Zachery]

considering you need to upgrade from each one
you need to convert from 2.2.9 or 2.3.x to b3 then b4 then b5 then b6 then b7 and so forth

so i dont see why there would be a problem with upgrading to just b6 from 2.3.0 unless the upgrade code had changed somewhere between b6 and b7 and inside one of the privious installers

[Bad Bunny]

considering you need to upgrade from each one
you need to convert from 2.2.9 or 2.3.x to b3 then b4 then b5 then b6 then b7 and so forth

so i dont see why there would be a problem with upgrading to just b6 from 2.3.0 unless the upgrade code had changed somewhere between b6 and b7 and inside one of the privious installers
That is incorrect. You do not need to upgrade from 2.x to vb3 beta3 then on up. You cannot even download the old betas any longer, so how could someone be expected to upgrade starting there? I didn't even realise that betas were released until beta4 was out.

[gab1982]

I think it's pretty clear that Microsoft doesn't delay realeases for any reason, even good reasons. :rolleyes: The key to programming for the masses is keeping users as homogenous as possible, in terms of deployment versions. The more people have to hack their boards, the harder it is for JelSoft to release vanilla upgrades that can be installed transparently. The strategic key will be for the core product to include enough functionality for most people not to have to hack. This will reduce the resistance to additional modules being released on a more regular basis. With more people running essentially vanilla boards, the developers won't have to worry so much about stepping on hacks when they develop new features.

My guess is that vB3 is intended to be a major level setter that will reduce the widespread need for hacks. That's the path to acceptance in the non-casual market where I live. That's also where the real money is if you can get established.

Nobody wants to have to jump vendors, and hacking is not the answer, nor is it really in JelSoft's best interests except for using hacks as a test environment for future feature releases. I think JelSoft is trying to upgrade itself into a stronger market presence with a broader base. I think that this direction is smart, but it's also really hurting those of us who really need it to happen.

If I had had ANY inkling that I would be left at the altar for six months, I probably would have started shopping, but I fell for the week-by-week optimism that has been peddled here. In a sense, the license fees do pay for vB 3 development, but Microsoft's approach would be to make us buy the new version outright. Point taken.oh but microsoft do delay windows take a look at windows longhorn for example, i seem to remembered the delayed it to 2005 when it was suppost to be out in 2003 but the posts before are correct, vbulletin dont code for you in general if your so bothered about those particular features, download vbulletin 2 and iether find those hacks at vbulletin.org or ask some people to make them for you. You have to spend money to make money and your losing business while twidling your thumbs waiting for vb3 so if i where you i would get someone to code the ones you need for vbulletin 2.

[gorman]

Multi-language support for one thing. Internationalisation can wait.Bah... wake up man. English is NOT the most commonly spoken language on planet Earth.

[poolking]

Bah... wake up man. English is NOT the most commonly spoken language on planet Earth.
One of the vbulletin staff has already addressed his post, so lets not retread old ground. :)

[Zachery]

That is incorrect. You do not need to upgrade from 2.x to vb3 beta3 then on up. You cannot even download the old betas any longer, so how could someone be expected to upgrade starting there? I didn't even realise that betas were released until beta4 was out.
your right you CANT get the old ones

but that what upgradeX.php does, it upgrades from vb X.X.X to vb X.X.X

i ran vb2.3.X to beta 5 i ran 5 update scripts that told me which beta i was upgrading to each time

[Erwin]

FWIW, after much server tweaking, I got the server loads back down. Not sure what it was, but it's okay now.

Check it out... it was a bad weekend for server loads, but after optimizing, and tweaking my my.cnf file, here we go:

[Weasel]

hey Erwin, what do you use to get the nifty graphs?

[BenSjoberg]

Looks like something from cPanel.

[Hurricane_GS]

It is a software called MRTG and can be found at:

http://www.mrtg.org

[M1th]

As a test, turn off the WYSIWYG editor and see if the speed improves.
no difference in speed.

[Scott MacVicar]

Bah... wake up man. English is NOT the most commonly spoken language on planet Earth.
Indeed

500 million people speak Madarin

[Kier]

Is it actually possible to upgrade from VBulletin 2.3.2 to Beta 7? It isn't possible to upgrade from 2.3.2 to Beta 6 - you get all sorts of errors which I listed in the troubleshooting thread.
You can upgrade to vBulletin 3 from vB2.2.9 and newer.

[Throwing Shapes]

One of the vbulletin staff has already addressed his post, so lets not retread old ground. :)____... ____ ___ ____ __! :mad:

[poolking]

____... ____ ___ ____ __! :mad:And what is that supposed to mean? I see you still dislike my style of posting. Still not got over your zealous over promotion of QCD? :D

[Throwing Shapes]

Meh, I think it's you that can't get over it. Since you obviously follow me around everyone on this board!! If you can't handle QCD (download.com's 5 star audio player!) that's fine, but stop crying about it! :p

[poolking]

Meh, I think it's you that can't get over it. Since you obviously follow me around everyone on this board!! If you can't handle QCD (download.com's 5 star audio player!) that's fine, but stop crying about it! :p
I do not follow around this board, period. Whenever you do reply to one of my posts, you never come up with a sensible answer. So who's really crying in this instance. :D

[Throwing Shapes]

You are, naturally. :D Now, if you're done being a know-it-all, please stop wasting people's time and space and allow this thread to discuss vb3 7!! :mad:

[UHN_ED]

Stop being idiots.

[Throwing Shapes]

Already done, won't be back unless it's to discuss something sensible in relation to this thread. :)

[adrianchew]

A quick thought - I wonder when vB3 will ever become an official release given the slow development, and in using this forum, the *ONLY* must-have feature in vB3 to me is the WYSIWYG editor - I'd say that is the single most important feature, but almost everything else is ok neat to someone or other, but isn't a biggie.

I'd rather just see the editor added to 2.x at this point, than waiting for the forever not even a release candidate vB3.

[Bad Bunny]

The conditional templating is what did it for me. Being able to do nearly unlimited things with the forums without even hacking them is a big plus for me.

And once development finally started up, it has been pretty quick by my perception. I am a little perterbed that I was told that vb3 would be released before my first year lease ended (and I'm several months into the next year heh), but I got over it.
I'm still debating as to whether or not I should upgrade from a beta 4 on one and a beta 6 on another.
Beside the occasional database error on the vb4 we haven't even run into any issues.

[cirisme]

IMO, the best features with vb3 are...

1) The muchly improved custom profile fields
2) The vastly improved calendar... love the holidays :D
3) Conditional templating, nice! Especially with the custom profile fields, it makes hacking that much easier :)
4) Multiple attachments and resizing of images

I absolutely love vb3 and can't wait to go live...

[Kwak]

I did not read the entire posts but if I upgrade from beta 6 to 7 (uploading all files), would it interfere with my images? Currently, most of my images are stored on another server.

[Lacrosse Boy]

Indeed

500 million people speak Madarin
However, English is the most "unified" language. That is, just about anywhere in the world yo ugo, English is known by someone. It is the common language.

I doubt that if you go somewhere, like Italy for example, that many people would speak Mandarin. You are more likely to find someone speaking English, as it is more widespread.

[Weasel]

However, English is the most "unified" language. That is, just about anywhere in the world yo ugo, English is known by someone. It is the common language.

I doubt that if you go somewhere, like Italy for example, that many people would speak Mandarin. You are more likely to find someone speaking English, as it is more widespread.
Why is this even being discussed. vBulletin 3 will have multi-language support...end of story.

[Bad Bunny]

I did not read the entire posts but if I upgrade from beta 6 to 7 (uploading all files), would it interfere with my images? Currently, most of my images are stored on another server.
If I read correctly, you just have some image renaming and path changes to make. That's about it.

[d3nnis]

still waiting for the stable release :(

[Zachery]

nothing is 100% stable, so why are you running 2.X?

[gorman]

Why is this even being discussed. vBulletin 3 will have multi-language support...end of story.Because I'm frankly quite tired of hearing anglo-centric comments on this forum. The developers have taken the sensible choice in implementing multi-language support and I don't want to see people attacking them for it. Since it was a regular feature in phpBB I was actually quite surprised in not finding it in 2.2.8 (surprised as in "I bought the license and discovered later that I needed to retranslate everything from scratch at every upgrade"). Sorry for being OT, anyway.

[Wayne Luke]

You are translating wrong... If you translate the vbulletin.style file you have to do it at every upgrade. This is the wrong way, no edits should be done in that file.

However if you translate the templates after install, then they won't be overwritten when you upgrade probably saving hundreds of hours of work.

Of course vBulletin 3 makes this even easier with language packs.

[ukbill69]

thanks guys, love vb and will always support you in all versions you bring out. Must be hard for all of you working on vb3. :) Keep up the good work!

[Lacrosse Boy]

Because I'm frankly quite tired of hearing anglo-centric comments on this forum. The developers have taken the sensible choice in implementing multi-language support and I don't want to see people attacking them for it. Since it was a regular feature in phpBB I was actually quite surprised in not finding it in 2.2.8 (surprised as in "I bought the license and discovered later that I needed to retranslate everything from scratch at every upgrade"). Sorry for being OT, anyway.
I just want to make it clear that I'm not "bashing" anything, and I hope my post didn't seem like that.

I was simply referring to the Mandarin post.

[pmatoso]

I need to make the translation of vb3 for português(Portugal), what I want to know is ,if in the next BETA I will need to translate everything another time.

If yes, what is the better way for translate the vb3?

[Weasel]

I need to make the translation of vb3 for português(Portugal), what I want to know is ,if in the next BETA I will need to translate everything another time.

If yes, what is the better way for translate the vb3?
Wait until RC is released (next release hopefully) to start translating.

[CricketWeb]

Well it definately doesn't work upgrading from VBulletin 2.3.2 to Beta 6 - it killed my test forums so I'm not willing to risk upgrading now.

I posted in the Support forums but no one responded :(

[Kier]

Well it definately doesn't work upgrading from VBulletin 2.3.2 to Beta 6 - it killed my test forums so I'm not willing to risk upgrading now.

I posted in the Support forums but no one responded :(
Could you explain exactly how it killed your test forums? When we tested the 2.3.2 => 3.0.0 Beta 6 upgrade it worked fine...

[Ky Kiske]

Beta 7 has been uber easy to use...I thought it was going to be tough.

[john_rsd]

Well it definately doesn't work upgrading from VBulletin 2.3.2 to Beta 6 - it killed my test forums so I'm not willing to risk upgrading now.

I posted in the Support forums but no one responded :(

I copied my 2.3.2 site to another hosts and tested it for 'upgradability' to vb3b7 just like you did

1st attempt I had some serious issues with corrupt tables, mysql errors etc but I did the upgrade before reading through a lot of the pain that others have had in other posts and took some note of their troubles/causes.

I did not spend too much time messing around trying to find the root cause as I knew the upgrade should work and it was less time intensive just to restore the site and try again. (seems lazy but time is precious.)

I managed to do a successful and painless upgrade only after I had reverted/restored all of my templates completely. I did not have any hacks to remove, but I had changed some templates quite a lot, moving some chunks of code around etc.

You did not mention if your test site had and mods or changes made to it?

[Chris Blount]

Just upgraded to Beta 7 and it went pretty well. Had to revert a couple of templates and move some graphics around but no biggy.

The only thing that bothers me is the speed decrease. Ever since I upgraded to Beta 6 my site has slowed down especially when loading threads (showthread). It take a few seconds longer to load them.
In regards to my earlier comment, I have noticed a slow and steady increase in speed since I posted this and I have not changed anything in the software. The only conclusion I can draw is something has worked itself out or there was a problem at my ISP.

In any case, things are working better now.

[Rasbelin]

1) the attachments as files hack
2) the ability for a user to be in multiple groups
3) multiple attachments for a single post
What are you whining here as that's all possible now? I'm sure you can get it done, if you are that professional as you claim to be.

My original setup for the Rasbey.com website used vB 2.3.0 and had multiple attachment support which worked after some little tinkering and using the hack available from vBulletin.org. No problem with it. Attachments as files would also have been possible, but then I would have had to tweak it to work with multiple attachments and also maintain vB3 upgrade compatibility. However if you only need the stable backbone of vB, I'm sure you can be just fine with 2.3.2 and then expand it's capabilities with those two hacks and code the multiple usergroups. For instance Apolyton Civilization Site has a similar thing to multiple usergoups called Civgroups, and they run vB 2.0.3, so it can well be done with the older vB 2.x.x. No need to wait for vB3 to go gold, if you have the necessary PHP scripting capabilities.

So please stop ventilating about it, because as you have been waiting for vB3 to go gold, you could have well picked up vB 2.3.2 and get off working with your customised corporate vB system.

[Rasbelin]

Okay, just making sure about the language system and localised translations, because I wouldn't want to waste my time with the Finnish and Swedish translations, unless I know that my work won't be wasted. :)

Right or wrong?

vB3 RC1 = language system completed and no more hardcoded text, but instead all phrases (including the standard texts in the Default Style template) will be as strings in the language system, so you won't have to use hardcoded text in your templates, and thus all templates are fully localised in all languages without extra work (except the buttons of, course)

[WebAddict]

Beta 7 looks good, I can't wait for RC1...

[Pirotess]

Just some friendly feedback for the devs from a common everyday casual user. My board started as a 2.2.1 board I believe. To date I am still running 2.2.6 mostly because I got sick of rehacking my board and because I thought a major board revision was coming. To explain, back on 8/2/02 there was a post from John telling us the beta site for VB3 was up. In the post was the following.


There are bugs left! (ok, this goes without saying!) We have been working very hard getting all the features coded in, and we have pretty much finished this now.
Its now a year and 2 months later and we still dont have an RC much less a gold release. Thats the mother of all teases. I can appreciate you want to release a stable product but as a poster mentioned just above, it will never be 100% stable and we're used to monthly updates anyway as illustrated from the 2.2.x boards. In my opinion somewhere along the line you got a serious case of feature creep that would have been better served coming in the incremental updates we're used to. I really dont blame people for being restless and yes I happen to be one of them. Its well past time for VB3 to be released. That being said I realize my post wont have any effect on your release cycle but I thought I'd add my voice to the others. Flames from the fanboys can be sent to /dev/null. Thanks.

[The Keeper]

Just some friendly feedback for the devs from a common everyday casual user. My board started as a 2.2.1 board I believe. To date I am still running 2.2.6 mostly because I got sick of rehacking my board and because I thought a major board revision was coming. To explain, back on 8/2/02 there was a post from John telling us the beta site for VB3 was up. In the post was the following.

Its now a year and 2 months later and we still dont have an RC much less a gold release. Thats the mother of all teases. I can appreciate you want to release a stable product but as a poster mentioned just above, it will never be 100% stable and we're used to monthly updates anyway as illustrated from the 2.2.x boards. In my opinion somewhere along the line you got a serious case of feature creep that would have been better served coming in the incremental updates we're used to. I really dont blame people for being restless and yes I happen to be one of them. Its well past time for VB3 to be released. That being said I realize my post wont have any effect on your release cycle but I thought I'd add my voice to the others. Flames from the fanboys can be sent to /dev/null. Thanks. That about sums up my feelings too.

[orozery]

Just some friendly feedback for the devs from a common everyday casual user. My board started as a 2.2.1 board I believe. To date I am still running 2.2.6 mostly because I got sick of rehacking my board and because I thought a major board revision was coming. To explain, back on 8/2/02 there was a post from John telling us the beta site for VB3 was up. In the post was the following.

Its now a year and 2 months later and we still dont have an RC much less a gold release. Thats the mother of all teases. I can appreciate you want to release a stable product but as a poster mentioned just above, it will never be 100% stable and we're used to monthly updates anyway as illustrated from the 2.2.x boards. In my opinion somewhere along the line you got a serious case of feature creep that would have been better served coming in the incremental updates we're used to. I really dont blame people for being restless and yes I happen to be one of them. Its well past time for VB3 to be released. That being said I realize my post wont have any effect on your release cycle but I thought I'd add my voice to the others. Flames from the fanboys can be sent to /dev/null. Thanks.
Yep...I also agree.
IMO it was better first to do the new style + language system, then fix bugs.
This way many people with non-english/customized templates boards could have upgraded to vB3 beta.

[Karri]

That about sums up my feelings too.
Ditto.

[d3nnis]

nothing is 100% stable, so why are you running 2.X?


i need to hack and add adition stuffs... there is no v3 hacks as of now :(

[MrNase]

ever been to vbulletin.nl ?


agree with orozery! I really don't want to know what bugs will come up after the new style is final...

[Wayne Luke]

Just some friendly feedback for the devs from a common everyday casual user. My board started as a 2.2.1 board I believe. To date I am still running 2.2.6 mostly because I got sick of rehacking my board and because I thought a major board revision was coming. To explain, back on 8/2/02 there was a post from John telling us the beta site for VB3 was up. In the post was the following.

Its now a year and 2 months later and we still dont have an RC much less a gold release. Thats the mother of all teases. I can appreciate you want to release a stable product but as a poster mentioned just above, it will never be 100% stable and we're used to monthly updates anyway as illustrated from the 2.2.x boards. In my opinion somewhere along the line you got a serious case of feature creep that would have been better served coming in the incremental updates we're used to. I really dont blame people for being restless and yes I happen to be one of them. Its well past time for VB3 to be released. That being said I realize my post wont have any effect on your release cycle but I thought I'd add my voice to the others. Flames from the fanboys can be sent to /dev/null. Thanks.
I think the main problem here was a premature opening of the alpha forum. However many of the changes that have occurred between then and now were a result of people getting a first preview look. Many of those requests were not minor requests and a lot had to change to facilitate them and maintain stability and scalability of the product.

Trust me, I personally think the product cycle has been too long and the software is dragging as well. However, continually looking at the code and the system it powers is a great end result that will allow better expandability and make it to add features incrementally in the future without continually patching an aging system.

[poolking]

I thought the whole purpose of this thread was to discuss the current beta, not to discuss people's annoyance at how long this is taking, how about posting your feelings in the vBulletin 3 Suggestions and Feedback forum.

Those who post ditto, or carry on posting their displeasure in the incorrect forum will prevent any constructive discussion of this current beta release.

I now await for the usual insults to be thrown at me, like stfu you don't know what you are talking about, etc..

For those of you who do not like the "fanboy" comments, you should think about what you are going to post.

Most of us "fanboys" don't sit idly by when at times Jelsoft is unjustly flamed or slandered.

Bringing up posts from the past doesn't help matters either, things can change between posts. Or do people think that life is one big constant that nothing changes?

People who pin projects on beta software and then blame Jelsoft for bugs or their projects are delayed because they relied upon beta software and they have now lost face and don't want to admit it , then come out with some BS that they've been involved for projects for years, just because you have been involved in projects for years, does not neccessarily mean that the projects you have been involved in have run smoothly or even been conducted properly and that they know best when it comes to software development and Jelsoft are rubbish at what they do.

None of us know how Jelsoft is structured what hours the developers do. Every company works different and have different practices, so who are we to judge how Jelsoft works or should work?

Sorry if my post sounds like a stuck record to some of you in here, well that is just tough.

So instead of following the flock, at least some of you come up with something original.

These developers are human beings as well and have flaws and are entitled to screw up, just because they are hidden behind a computer screen, it does not give anyone an excuse to flame them, or flame others who try to defend them.

What makes me sick is the comments I here time after time "Oh, Jelsoft are only in it for the money, they don't care about their customers, stuff them, we will go elsewhere."

If that were the case then we would have the crappest forum software on the planet.

So I'll get in a stfu first for a change and stop complaining and be constructive and help Jelsoft put right what is wrong.

Morale can go a long way and would I like to code for customers who constantly complain about the same things and then don't give you a chance to put it right? I don't think so.

There are too many "experts" in here telling Jelsoft what they should and shouldn't do. Instead of suggesting there is too much demanding, too much me me me me.

Demanding features just for themselves when 99% of admins may not want the feature you are after and then go off complaining saying Jelsoft are ignoring you.

For those of you who go off complaining because the devs and support staff haven't answered your question within 1 minute, stop and think about the following factors:

1. There are loads of posts in a day, so your post may get missed.

2. There are lot of members who want attention from the staff, so they may miss you in the rush.

3. The differing time zones, when you start complaining that a dev or staff member hasn't answered your query that you posted at 10 in the morning, without thinking it might be 2 in the morning in their time zone.

The internet community maybe a global thing but timezones differ, so think before complaining.

So step back, take a deep breath and think about what you are posting.

That is my rant over for the moment, as you can see this probably the longest ever post I have posted on here, but I had to get this off my chest.

Feel free to take on board what I say, feel free to ignore it and put me on your ignore list as I know that someone of you would love to do because you can't stand that someone's views may differ from your own.

Feel free to flame me, as I can guarantee that you will, if you do, just think that this thread may be closed if the insults start flying and then ruin the opportunity for discussion for everyone else.

Rant now officially over.

[cirisme]

Yep...I also agree.
IMO it was better first to do the new style + language system, then fix bugs.
This way many people with non-english/customized templates boards could have upgraded to vB3 beta.
I totally disagree. It's unprofessional for Jelsoft to release a buggy product, and it's even more unprofessional to use a buggy forum on a professional/large forum. But if you're running a small board, I can understand your sentiments.

[jluerken]

Wow, I think poolking has to much time :D but most of the things he said are right. I started with Jelsoft a few days ago now and never used a vB 2.x as admin, only as user so I don't know much about the long waiting period that others may have had so far.

Before this thread is becoming more and more off topic one last word on this. I have the feeling that Jelsoft is working with high pressure on an RC by fixing bug for bug the testers find and they seem to be still open for comments.

I send in some for the current beta 7 (design failures, simple text failures or additions to existing code) and I feel heard so far.

Again and again I can say that not everyone buying a board software here is a teenager with enough time to play around with a not stable release called RC :D
Jelsoft should take as much time as they need to fix bugs, test and optimize the code BEFORE they release cause some owners have a business running with the board.

btw. there were 2 main aspects why I bought this software.
1st is that there seems to be a giant hacking family making a good job to bring in everything possible and
2nd the fact that many other well known webscripts can be fully integrated into vB or the way around.

Hopefully Jelsoft reminds on the 2nd point and brings out a good documentation and new import scripts for people changing from other board software to the new vB version :D

[poolking]

I totally disagree. It's unprofessional for Jelsoft to release a buggy product, and it's even more unprofessional to use a buggy forum on a professional/large forum. But if you're running a small board, I can understand your sentiments.
So why do you think Jelsoft release beta versions?

[Bad Bunny]

I found it sort of annoying to upgrade this time around, but the end result is favorable. One thing I find is odd though...it seems there is no variable for smilies at all. So all your styles have to share the same smilies still? This seems like an oversight possibly?

Or is there some reason smilies are universal? Or perhaps I have missed this and it really is there but I missed it.

[Karri]

Those who post ditto, or carry on posting their displeasure in the incorrect forum will prevent any constructive discussion of this current beta release.

I am forced to take that personally as you all but quoted my post. If you have a problem with my politely posting my slight displeasure over being a bit mislead while not resorting to attacking anyone, feel free to ignore my posts or take it up with me personally. If any mod has a problem with my posts being in the wrong thread as you put it, it is up to them to inform me of my rule breaking or to move or remove my post. Since you don't appear to be a mod or a developer, I don't see where you have the right or that it is your place to do either. If you have anything further to say to me on the subject, feel free to PM me as responding to me here would "prevent any constructive discussion of this current beta release." The current beta release which I was basically agreeing to a post about, is a year over due.

[poolking]

I am forced to take that personally as you all but quoted my post. If you have a problem with my politely posting my slight displeasure over being a bit mislead while not resorting to attacking anyone, feel free to ignore my posts or take it up with me personally. If any mod has a problem with my posts being in the wrong thread as you put it, it is up to them to inform me of my rule breaking or to move or remove my post. Since you don't appear to be a mod or a developer, I don't see where you have the right or that it is your place to do either. If you have anything further to say to me on the subject, feel free to PM me as responding to me here would "prevent any constructive discussion of this current beta release." The current beta release which I was basically agreeing to a post about, is a year over due.
I have not singled out anyone, I have not quoted anyone's post directly. The right I have is that this is an open forum where I am entitled to voice my opinion.

This is a thread about the discussion of Beta 7, the current release, I take the comments of displeasure of the development as a whole not just Beta 7 as feedback, so that is where I would post my displeasure and suggest to Jelsoft where they can put something right in the future, not bringing up the same arguments time and again, maybe I should have said an inappropriate forum.

I am not saying don't complain, but do it in the appropriate forum, and when it is actually called for and not an insult to Jelsoft.

I would normally take this to pm if I had singled a person out, but as I have not, I don't feel I should take it to pm.

I am not trying to do the staff's job for them. As I keep saying time and again, I will come to the defence of Jelsoft if they are being treated unfairly, when I am in this mode of posting, I don't single out inviduals.

If I see more than one person making the same or similar post, I will address them as a single entity and not discriminate who I refer to.


If I wanted to single someone out, I wouldn't beat around the bush, their name would appear at the beginning of my post, or I would reply directly to that person's quote.

I will always shoot from the hip and I make no apologies for doing so.

I will only curb my tongue if I am requested to do so by the staff, until that time, I will carry on posting the way I do.

[Wayne Luke]

Poolking,

Everyone has a right to discuss their opinions. This is simply a thread. It is not to gauge how many people install the newest beta but to discuss anything revolving around the beta. To some that includes a displeasure on the length of time it has taken.

If you have problems with posts in a thread, there is a report post feature which you can use and the moderators will act as we see appropriate. No more no less. Our jobs are hard enough without people trying to do them for us.

[poolking]

Ok, but I saw this thread as a discussion of the current beta and not the development as a whole. I would expect to see such grievances in the feedback forum as they see that something is wrong, so that to me is feedback.

I will only report a post if it turns to derogatory comments of an individual or an untruth is told.

I have already said that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but at least try to formulate an opinion of their own and post it in an appropriate place. As said I'm not trying to do your job for you.

[marocnl]

Just some friendly feedback for the devs from a common everyday casual user. My board started as a 2.2.1 board I believe. To date I am still running 2.2.6 mostly because I got sick of rehacking my board and because I thought a major board revision was coming. To explain, back on 8/2/02 there was a post from John telling us the beta site for VB3 was up. In the post was the following.

Its now a year and 2 months later and we still dont have an RC much less a gold release. Thats the mother of all teases. I can appreciate you want to release a stable product but as a poster mentioned just above, it will never be 100% stable and we're used to monthly updates anyway as illustrated from the 2.2.x boards. In my opinion somewhere along the line you got a serious case of feature creep that would have been better served coming in the incremental updates we're used to. I really dont blame people for being restless and yes I happen to be one of them. Its well past time for VB3 to be released. That being said I realize my post wont have any effect on your release cycle but I thought I'd add my voice to the others. Flames from the fanboys can be sent to /dev/null. Thanks.
Agreed

[The Keeper]

I suppose when it comes down to it, I'm just glad of such an amazing piece of software for such a (relatively) small price. It is pretty poor that we've waited so long for vB3. I don't see what else needs to be done. Beta 7 is pretty sweet with just one or two minor probs. If I were in charge, I'd have released a gold copy and just put up with a few weeks of complaints and fixes, then released vB 3.0.1

[Yaa 101]

Seeing the sourcecode i must disagree with things took too long, you must remember that this is not some website stuff written to run in one place...
It has to be compatible with both Servers and Browsers and we all know that we are still not over this incompatibility crap that our friends at MS, Netscape and Opera are responsible for, though last year slowly things change for the better as now finally webbrowser developers noticed there is such a place as W3C... It took the makers of Moz about 5 years to gain momentum towards this direction, was and M$ isn't even trying to follow standards and Opera is totally DOM limp...
In this environment one must write a PHP (itself still evolving fast as language) program that is compatible with both servers and browsers, let php generate javascripts and fill in templates etc...
This takes a while, btw did you notice how clean the code is now, all sources are cleaned and have better comments...
I personally think they are on schedule, also I remember a update of licence of several months...

[Aharon]

I just wanted to take this time to thank the developers of VB3. I am running a large 2.2.x board and we are currently working towards a beta 2.3.x site for us (over 700,000 posts site). We appreciate the fact you guys are spending your time to build a stable, secure message forum product for our users. Please take any amount of time you need to finalize a quality produce. Good luck guys.

[AlexanderT]

TODAY I am finally upgrading from vB 2.3.2 to vB 3.0 Beta 7. I have been following the product cycle since Beta 1 and I am more than impressed by the improvements and bugtracking since then.

Just continue like this to make vB 3 the most stable and advanced forum software.

Just my two cents...

[Jake Bunce]

Thread moderated.

[LilPimpnRapper]

When is Vb3 coming out cuz im waiting till it comes out to but it...

[DarkDelight.net]

When is Vb3 coming out cuz im waiting till it comes out to but it...

Soon, we hope.

Keep an eye on the Announcements (http://www.vbulletin.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=1) forum.

[Keyser Söze]

i dont think things have "taken too long" i just think it was a mistake letting the cat out bag in aug 02, i mean u wet our mouths for food we wont have for well over a year, not good, it will be worth the wait but i think it was a mistake


think about it this way if there had never been a mention of vb3 until very close to the beta release would ppl be SO anxtious now? i dont think it would be like this, ppl are excited as much as they are frusterated

[BigJohnson]

Well then it would have taken longer to get developed because everyone is beta testing it and reported errors.

It is not about wether if it is a mistake or not. There is no question there. Beta testing it was is the purpose.

Rumors is what gets people aggrivated.

[Keyser Söze]

im not questioning the beta testing, that started what last march-april? im saying the annoucements last august

thats all

[S.Shady]

ok, i need help. im having a noob moment havnt been home at all practily for a good month. i cant remember anything either so it doesnt help. anyway

what i need to know is are these buttons going to be used on the new style or are they going to be made from scratch?

im sorry for the question but i wont be on long enough to find it in a post

[RGSerge]

i dont think things have "taken too long" i just think it was a mistake letting the cat out bag in aug 02, i mean u wet our mouths for food we wont have for well over a year, not good, it will be worth the wait but i think it was a mistake


think about it this way if there had never been a mention of vb3 until very close to the beta release would ppl be SO anxtious now? i dont think it would be like this, ppl are excited as much as they are frusterated.

I agree absolutely on that one. It has seemed a very long time, and I have only been using vbulletin since 2.2.7, so I do sympathise with those who have been waiting for longer.

I do think in future, you should not let the cat out the bag so early unless you can give an at least semi-accurate release date. People would handle it better then. Even if you cant keep to it, it gives people some insight as to what they are waiting for.

Personally, if you were to tell me now that vb3 RC1 would be out sometime in december, then in december say, well, its going to be January, maybe febuary due to some unexpected bugs. I'd accept that as I'd rather have a perfect application late, than a flawed one on time.

Well, thats my bloated 2 cents anyway :D

[hashesh]

Is there going to be an update counter for initial implimentation? I would like to set peoples reps for what they have already done...

[Tungsten]

Personally, if you were to tell me now that vb3 RC1 would be out sometime in december, then in december say, well, its going to be January, maybe febuary due to some unexpected bugs. I'd accept that as I'd rather have a perfect application late, than a flawed one on time.
I've seen it stated on at least one occasion by a Jelsoft staffer, here on these forums, that they hope to have the final release of vB3 done by Christmas of this year because many of them have other projects that they would like to be working on.

I figure if they release RC1 sometime in October, that gives them a two month window to hammer out RC2 (if needed) and go to "gold status" on vB3 by the end of the year. We're only two months away from December, folks. Keep that in mind! :D

[jluerken]

Not necessarily, a developer could decide that something needs tweaking, for example the look of something before they decide to go gold.


This is a special thing only american guys have.

In germany we have beta's and finals, there is nothing between. A buggy RC makes no sense to me cause then its another beta again and if you tweak a final then its a new version to me.

tweaking and bugfixing are two different things.

If there are no new features coming up its a version step like 3.0.1
If you implement something big new that its an upgrade like 3.1.0
and from 2.x to 3.x its a complete new product a rewrite :D

Easy or? hehe

[FASherman]

Not exactly right. Once upon a time, the standard for versioning software was X.Y.Z, where

Z - the number of bug fixes since the last minor release
Y - the number of minor releases since the last major release
Z - the number of major releases under the current software branding

[Rici]

In germany we hav