vbPortal is not free anymore.

[Marvelous]

The only way to get the software is by paying to become a member of their site which is only $20. It's no big deal, but I could have sworn that it was published under some sort of license that stated that the software had to be free or something of that nature. I could be wrong but I really think this is the case. If so, is this illegal or in violation with the license?

[Cary]

I believe they've been charging for it for quite some time now... I may be mistaken, though.

If you don't want to pay for a portal system, head on over to http://vbulletin.org - you'll find some free ones over there.

[Marvelous]

Look what I found by the guy that runs vbPortl.

I...The Nuke portions of vbPortal are covered under the GNU/GPL license. The portions that integrate Nuke and vBulletin are not, they are copyright by phpPortals. This means that I reserve the sole right to produce and distribute vbPortal unless prior permission is obtained.

So this means, I can take the Nuke code, make it use the same accounts as another program and sell it for a profit? It just doesn't seem right to me.

[Cary]

Read http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#GPLCommercially for the answer to that question.

[Marvelous]

You are allowed to sell copies of the modified program commercially, but only under the terms of the GNU GPL. Thus, for instance, you must make the source code available to the users of the program as described in the GPL, and they must be allowed to redistribute and modify it as described in the GPL.
These requirements are the condition for including the GPL-covered code you received in a program of your own.

Cool, so if I get a copy, it's not illegal to give it to other people.

[Techguy1]

except the vb integration part.

[Marvelous]

Using the GNU GPL will require that all the released improved versions be free software.

Hmm, I think vbPortal falls under this category, since it just improved to work with vBulletin.

[UHN_ED]

It does not fall under that catergory because there is original code (the vb integration code). Improvements would be bug fixes and such, there is original code in vBportal. It is illegal to re-distribute it.

[Marvelous]

It does not fall under that catergory because there is original code (the vb integration code). Improvements would be bug fixes and such, there is original code in vBportal. It is illegal to re-distribute it.

Hmm, this is from the page that cary linked too.

Combining two modules means connecting them together so that they form a single larger program. If either part is covered by the GPL, the whole combination must also be released under the GPL--if you can't, or won't, do that, you may not combine them.

One being the original nuke code, and the other being the vb integration.

[Vile]

The only way to get the software is by paying to become a member of their site which is only $20. It's no big deal, but I could have sworn that it was published under some sort of license that stated that the software had to be free or something of that nature. I could be wrong but I really think this is the case. If so, is this illegal or in violation with the license?$20 is pretty darn cheap; it's well worth it. ;)

[Marvelous]

You are allowed to sell copies of the modified program commercially, but only under the terms of the GNU GPL. Thus, for instance, you must make the source code available to the users of the program as described in the GPL, and they must be allowed to redistribute and modify it as described in the GPL.
These requirements are the condition for including the GPL-covered code you received in a program of your own.

It does fall under that category. vbPortal took the nuke code and made it into vbPortal. Since Nuke code was under the GPL license, vbPortal, that uses nuke's code must also release under the GPL license. And under the GPL license you are allowed to redistribute the source or modify the source and release it.

[Marvelous]

$20 is pretty darn cheap; it's well worth it. ;)
Yea, I know its cheap, and most likely going to pay it whenever I get my vBulletin license, but that is not the point.

[merk]

It does not fall under that catergory because there is original code (the vb integration code). Improvements would be bug fixes and such, there is original code in vBportal. It is illegal to re-distribute it.
It doesnt?

If I use a piece of software that has been obtained under the GNU GPL, am I allowed to modify the original code into a new program, then distribute and sell that new program commercially? (http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#TOCGPLCommercially)

You are allowed to sell copies of the modified program commercially, but only under the terms of the GNU GPL. Thus, for instance, you must make the source code available to the users of the program as described in the GPL, and they must be allowed to redistribute and modify it as described in the GPL. These requirements are the condition for including the GPL-covered code you received in a program of your own.

and


I'd like to incorporate GPL-covered software in my proprietary system. Can I do this? (http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#TOCGPLInProprietarySystem)

You cannot incorporate GPL-covered software in a proprietary system. The goal of the GPL is to grant everyone the freedom to copy, redistribute, understand, and modify a program. If you could incorporate GPL-covered software into a non-free system, it would have the effect of making the GPL-covered software non-free too. .....

[phill2003]

I'd like to incorporate GPL-covered software in my proprietary system. Can I do this?

You cannot incorporate GPL-covered software in a proprietary system. The goal of the GPL is to grant everyone the freedom to copy, redistribute, understand, and modify a program. If you could incorporate GPL-covered software into a non-free system, it would have the effect of making the GPL-covered software non-free too. .....

i could be and most likely am wrong but that bit looks to me to be saying that if vbportals want to continue to offer this only to paying customers they need to take all the gpl covered software out?

mind you i have asked for feedback from vbportals on this...

[Dave-G]

I think what is being missed here is the major point...

vbPortal is not selling the software, it is charging for access to a members area and support, the fact you can only obtain the "latest" version via a members only access is maybe what is confusing people.

The version that has been discontinued was ver 8.1 and it did have lots of old nuke code but it was also freely available to download via a link on the front page.

Also vbPortal has and still is under going a major rewrite from the botton up removing old code and replacing it with their own, but this part should be explained by one of the developers and not me.

[Marvelous]

I think what is being missed here is the major point...

vbPortal is not selling the software, it is charging for access to a members area and support, the fact you can only obtain the "latest" version via a members only access is maybe what is confusing people.


If that is the only way to get the product, then yes, you are charging for it. But looking at the GPL license, it is legal to sell it, but also legal for the people to buy it to give it away.


The version that has been discontinued was ver 8.1 and it did have lots of old nuke code but it was also freely available to download via a link on the front page.

There is no publicly available vbPortal right now.


Also vbPortal has and still is under going a major rewrite from the botton up removing old code and replacing it with their own, but this part should be explained by one of the developers and not me.

This is fine and dandy, but the version that is out now should be under the GPL license. When the new version vbPortal that is fully rewritten comes out, they can charge whatever they want and I won't say a word.


My main beef is that they claim that vbPortal is free when it actually isn't. If they would have said that it cost $20 now, then all would be good, but the GPL license would still be in affect, so I could just give it away to anyone and not be doing anything illegal.

[thebigboss]

No where does it say under GPL that you can't distribute code to a select few, ie premium members.

[Marvelous]

No where does it say under GPL that you can't distribute code to a select few, ie premium members.
This is not even the point anymore, they can sell it to whoever they want. The point I'm trying to make now is, whoever buys it can give it away for free without doing anything illegal.

[phill2003]

i emailed the board of directors at the Open Source Initiative and asked there opinion...

i gave the details and included the copyright that is in the index.php file and as far as i'm aware most other's this is what i got back........

phill writes:
> this is the copyright thing they put in the top of the index.php file, and
> as far as i'm aware its in all the rest..

They're distributing a version that they claim YOU cannot distribute
with this license? Guess what? You are free to redistribute it, and
there is nothing they can do to you, because THEY licensed it that way.
Just be careful not to distribute anything that doesn't have that
license statement in it. By the way, they have already lost their
right to distribute phpnuke, because the GPL says that you cannot
require people to execute another license. The phpnuke copyright
holders could sue them for copyright infringement.

> // LICENSE
> //
> // This program is free software; you can redistribute it and/or
> // modify it under the terms of the GNU General Public License (GPL)
> // as published by the Free Software Foundation; either version 2
> // of the License, or (at your option) any later version.

--
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Crynwr sells support for free software | PGPok | shall not pass a law
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | without reciting it twice
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213 | +1 315 268 9201 FAX | from memory without flaw.

[bouncer18]

they are not selling vbportal.

vbportal is free.

by DONATING $20 you get the oppertunity to download versions not yet released to the public.

[bahawolf]

they are not selling vbportal.

vbportal is free.

by DONATING $20 you get the oppertunity to download versions not yet released to the public.
Oh well, I don't like vBPortal anyway... blah.

[Marvelous]

they are not selling vbportal.

vbportal is free.

by DONATING $20 you get the oppertunity to download versions not yet released to the public.
You can look at it anyway you want, but the fact is that, there is NO version to download without being a member. I see if the software was in beta, but the FINAL CODE for the new version is out. And we already stated that it is not illegal to sell it. But they cannot take any legal action if someone gives it away or sell it themselves.

[wajones]

You can look at it anyway you want, but the fact is that, there is NO version to download without being a member. I see if the software was in beta, but the FINAL CODE for the new version is out. And we already stated that it is not illegal to sell it. But they cannot take any legal action if someone gives it away or sell it themselves.

The current release vbPortal 2.0 alpha 8.1 is again available for download.

vbPortal 2.3.0 is a Release Candidate 1 and I can't understand why you are trying to cause so much controversy?

vbPortal version pr8.1 was pulled mainly because the coding was not adequate for vBulletin 2.30 and we are only supporting the current version. "Most" (legal vBulletin) users are at 2.30 and in support of Jelsoft the easiest way to support their fight against pirated software was to remove support for older versions of their product.

The new version has been re-written for vBulletin 2.30, and it is in final testing by our Premium Members. It is not a released product and is available for testing only by our members which doubly serve as our test team.

This fully complies with GNU General Public License (GPL) , but it should be finished and released within a couple weeks

We do have the option of not doing it at all anymore, especially if we can't afford it, and I guess others could try to rip off our work and give it away as some of you are suggesting, but our legal advice is that we are well within the bounds of our rights.

We try very hard to support the vBulletin community as best we can, we have I feel helped a lot of people put together their web sites and have been responsible for hundreds, if not a thousand or more people purchasing vBulletin.

We hope to continue that support with vbPortal for vbulletin 3.0, but it depends on the community and their support for us also. I personally don't think it's wrong to charge for membership, all told we probably make at the most $2 an hour, but most of the time, only pay the bills, LOL, I'm retired and do this for fun and it helps buy the wife a new dress occastionally, in return she allows me to work on vbPortal.

If you guy's want to work toward spoiling that, be my guest. It won't be the first time I've had to confront adversity.

Again, we should have it finished and released within a couple weeks.

[wajones]

In order to sooth the controversy which is highly unneeded and not appropriate for the vBulletin forums I have put the current release vbPortal 2.0 apha 8.1 back into the downloads area at phpportals.com. I thought I was doing a good thing by removing it :confused:

[Vile]

In order to sooth the controversy which is highly unneeded and not appropriate for the vBulletin forums I have put the current release vbPortal 2.0 apha 8.1 back into the downloads area at phpportals.com. I thought I was doing a good thing by removing it :confused:


Just ignore them. vBP is by far the best CMS for vB but if they "don't like vBPortal anyway" and are not willing to donate, they don't need to use it, simple as that.

I also agree that this does not need to be discussed here, and would fit better at the vbp website.

[wajones]

Just ignore them. vBP is by far the best CMS for vB but if they "don't like vBPortal anyway" and are not willing to donate, they don't need to use it, simple as that.

Thanks, now I didn't start this but, these controversies always crop up and for some reason I always end up getting twice as many new "paying" premium members and more vBulletins get sold.

BTW, 2.3.0 RC 2 will be available sometime this week. If all goes well, then the release should follow soon.

Please note, this isn't intended to be an advertisement. The vBulletin staff knows I am always quiet and do not lurk, leech,spam or push vbPortal. All I'm doing is defending myself.

[Tolitz]

People always want freebies ... they do all kinds of things like asking for it, demand it or argue their way into getting it ...

The vbportal detractors didn't do their research properly - which is expected ;)

[Dave-G]

Mmm did not notice, Marvelous you just registered here and the first post (all posts in fact) is to moan about a non vB issue? Interesting!!

[RobAC]

I find it interesting that one of the members that is doing the most bitching in this thread states that they don't like the product and don't have any plans on using it. So is your life truly that boring that you need to start a thread like this to cause trouble?

It's unfortunate that some people have the false realization that everything on the web is free and everything found on the web should be free. Sorry folks, that just isn't the way it works. Someone has to pay the bills. Someone has to pay for the electricity to power servers, routers, etc. Someone has to pay for the hardware, the upkeep and the maintenance. NOTHING in life comes for free. Someone has to pay for it.

You have a choice here. If you want vbPortal - you can download it for free and install it. If you want access to the pre-production betas and/or primary support for your installation of the product, you are asked to donate $20 for access to the Member-Only Support forums.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that and if you're too damn cheap to break open your piggy bank and fork over $20, you shouldn't be running a web site period.:rolleyes:

No, I am not one of their forum moderators or coders. I'm a customer.

[merk]

You have a choice here. If you want vbPortal - you can download it for free and install it. If you want access to the pre-production betas and/or primary support for your installation of the product, you are asked to donate $20 for access to the Member-Only Support forums.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that and if you're too damn cheap to break open your piggy bank and fork over $20, you shouldn't be running a web site period.:rolleyes:

No, I am not one of their forum moderators or coders. I'm a customer.

Ah, i was under the impression you couldnt download vbportal at all anymore. Meh, while being a great thing it was too bloated for my needs and i went with a simple 12 line script to do what i needed ;)

[Yappi]

Interesting reading here. I can honestly say that I see both sides of the argument. If a product is free and the people who distribute it say that you cannot incorporate it into another product and then charge for it, then you shouldn't be charging for it.

Charging for access to a support forum seems to be a fair thing to do becuase it probably helps offset some costs.

Making the download only available in the members section is a little questionable because it gives the appearance of paying for the product. Explicitly telling people they cannot redistribute seems to be against the GPL.

I've seen many programs available for free but support comes at a price. That is exactly what this one looks like it should be.

[FASherman]

You can always do what PHPNuke themselves do: make the public version two or three versions removed. In order to get the latest and greatest when it is released, you must be a "club member". Otherwise, you must wait 30 days or so before it becomes "publicly available".

Club membership costs not $20/yr but rather $20/mo. PHPNuke can't complain because you are doing exactly what they do so it is consistent wit the original license.

[Tolitz]

hehe, first of all, some facts that weren't bothered to be researched:

vBPortal has a freely downloadable version, which does not require a "donation" ... the only thing that you can't download freely are the alpha/beta of the newest versions, which are open to "members" who donate $20, not per year, but as a one-time donation for the development of the software.

So you CAN download vbportal, even if you don't donate anything ... you just won't be able to take part in the newest versions of it unless you express your support via the $20 donation. This is a thank-you for those who support the software, not exactly payment to use it ... besides, premium member benefits are not exactly a new thing on the Internet.

I don't see a problem there, and frankly, I don't see why it's such a big deal :)

[Dave-G]

So you CAN download vbportal, even if you don't donate anything ... you just won't be able to take part in the newest versions of it unless you express your support via the $20 donation.

Also they can get the Premium Membership Free & thus the latest version FREE by buying via one of the affilated links Banners, like vBulletin, Photopost etc. All this information on this is contained on the site under Premium membership link :)