Communitech.net and vBulletin

[SonnetCelestial]

I am wondering if anyone is planning to install vBulletin to Communitech.net If so please tell me afterwards how things go. I have an account with them and I'm wondering if I should change my ubb to vBulletin.

[evoir]

Communitech. They seem (on paper) like a dreamboat....But I have heard BAD stories about them. BAD tech support....bad bad.

Would love to hear from folks about that!

Sorry I don't have a direct answer...

Evoir

[Edited by evoir on 05-02-2000 at 04:21 PM]

[SonnetCelestial]

Well they're not BAD but as for running a UBB forum..NO...don't even do it. I'm not sure if vBulletin is the same resource wise but if you suck up their cpu then don't think about using their services...

[doron]

I'm a Communitech customer, and the bad stuff you hear is because they are rpone to close sites that break their TOS without much of a warning. Which is not bad, just bad for the person breaking the TOS.

SonnetCelestial - the best thing would be a freeware to check out the board, but seems that will take a bit. Since VB is less resoruce hungry, I think the reaper program won't hit you. I actually emailed the CT people about looing at vb, since they need a UBB replacement.

[SonnetCelestial]

Well I think with ANY big board the reaper would hit you if you don't manage the posts and the size of it. I'm not sure how important the database sizes are in vBulletin however I know in UBB pruning threads was essential to making it a healthy program.

I would like to say that VB is the one for me but unless I can test out either a beta or something else and see how the server handles it, I don't want to second guess on it.

[Alwaysmefirst]

Originally posted by SonnetCelestial
Well they're not BAD but as for running a UBB forum..NO...don't even do it. I'm not sure if vBulletin is the same resource wise but if you suck up their cpu then don't think about using their services...

SonnetCelestial: how big was your UBB there? I had up to 260 Mb used by UBB and it worked fine. I just pruned it lately and now it has around 35 Mb.

Olly

[WebStyles]

Well I think with ANY big board the reaper would hit you if you don't manage the posts and the size of it. I'm not sure how important the database sizes are in vBulletin however I know in UBB pruning threads was essential to making it a healthy program.

You're mistaken there. Pruning the UBB was neccessary because it was not written very well. The reaper would get you because of the time it took to execute all the code to muddle through it's millions of text files. VBulletin uses a mySQL database, and stores information in a more optimized fashion (ie: not duplicated in ten different places). Also, I find it worth mentioning that our UBB took upwards of 250 MB of space up, and after we switched to VBulletin, the same data takes up about 40 MB.

Wandrer has done some quite extensive performance tests on UBB and VBulletin. Once UBB hit about 75,000 threads, posting times skyrocketed (which is when the reaper would catch you)... VBulletin stayed steady throughout all the tests.

[Edited by WebStyles on 05-16-2000 at 04:13 PM]

[doron]

the reason i used to get hit was during extensive searches on UBB - mysql should be much less resource-hungry on searching

[Alwaysmefirst]

Originally posted by doron
the reason i used to get hit was during extensive searches on UBB - mysql should be much less resource-hungry on searching

mysql should be much less resource hungry on searching but is it the case with Vbulletin?
I disabled the search for all forums on my ubb to prevent the problem you had...it is only possible to do a search through one forum.

Olly

[werehere]

Yes the search on my forum is very fast through all forums. In fact it is faster than searching any one forum on just about any UBB I can find, but on my vbulletin it is searching through all forums:)

[doron]

having one central mysql database with a 'post' table should be much faster than a flat text database search.

[Alwaysmefirst]

Originally posted by doron
having one central mysql database with a 'post' table should be much faster than a flat text database search.



doron: do you have Vbulletin installed on a CT account? I use CT and FQ as web hosts and plan to buy and install Vbulletin this weekend. I would like to know how it works at CT.

Olly

[DonV]

The last time I checked, Communitech did *NOT* compile PHP into their Apache daemons - it runs as a CGI, like Perl. vB may be just as much or possibly even *MORE* of a load on the server than a UBB (!!!!!!), depending how heavily loaded the server already is.... MySQL won't help you if the reaper decides to make you its primary target....

[WebStyles]

Not sticking up for Communitech or anything... But on *their* server at least, they have PHP compiled into Apache (and mod_perl and AuthMySQL!). I also checked a friend of mine's domain who is hosted by Communitech, and he's got PHP compiled into Apache as well. :)

[DonV]

My information might be out of date. I stopped reading their support forums a few months ago.

Then again... Are you *SURE* they're running mod_perl? That's an incredibly memory consuming process. No host in its right mind would run mod_perl on anything but a dedicated server. Then again, I've never known CT to be in their right mind.

[Alwaysmefirst]

Originally posted by DonV
My information might be out of date. I stopped reading their support forums a few months ago.

Then again... Are you *SURE* they're running mod_perl? That's an incredibly memory consuming process. No host in its right mind would run mod_perl on anything but a dedicated server. Then again, I've never known CT to be in their right mind.

I will tell you this weekend if the board works there well :cool:
I just bought Vbulletin :) :) :) and will try to install it on CT...If it doesn't work, I will try on Futurequest or on a dedicated server.

[WebStyles]

Then again... Are you *SURE* they're running mod_perl? That's an incredibly memory consuming process. No host in its right mind would run mod_perl on anything but a dedicated server. Then again, I've never known CT to be in their right mind.

I'm not sure... I just checked through Netcraft, and that's what it said. :)

[DonV]

Originally posted by WebStyles
I'm not sure... I just checked through Netcraft, and that's what it said. :) That proves it! CT's nuts. Then again, who ever said regular clients could access mod_perl? *L*

[WebStyles]

Originally posted by DonV
Then again, who ever said regular clients could access mod_perl? *L*

That's what I was trying to say... mod_perl only showed up on their server. ;)

[SonnetCelestial]

My forum was around 110MB and had quite a few posters. those who have seen it say that it should cause no problem but I beg to differ... Unfortunately the dedicated route is the only way I can see a forum thriving. I am not even too sure that vBulletin can fnction on virtual accounts after hearing the usage of Memory it needs for popular forums. This may be a PHP related issue but again realistically speaking why are people having problems on a dedicated server now and trying to press for more ram?

It is all scaring me quite thoroughly. I'm not sure what to pick now and I'm glad I have not yet decided on which forum to use.

[wandrer]

I am not even too sure that vBulletin can fnction on virtual accounts after hearing the usage of Memory it needs for popular forums. This may be a PHP related issue but again realistically speaking why are people having problems on a dedicated server now and trying to press for more ram?

The only question as to whether ubb / wwwthreads / phorum / vbulletin / webbbs could function under a given virtual / dedicated account is how much traffic is expected. vBulletin could definately handle more traffic than any of the others. It is based on a very solid foundation (php / mysql). With that said, with a certain traffic level and on the same server setup - vbulletin is far more capable than ubb. It could handle more users, more posts, more everything.

Now, if you are running a forum that is getting 10000's of page views per day and 1000's of posts per day, you are going to need memory. mySQL is a very efficient database application, but it needs memory to run. On my personal setups, the mysql daemon runs with 4 or 8MB memory and it runs nice. For higher volume setups, you would need to increase that so that it would have a better chance of having the information in RAM versus HD. 16MB, 24MB, 32MB per daemon eats up a lot of system RAM very quickly. But then again, you would be foolish to run a high volume website with just 32/64/128MB RAM.

[Alwaysmefirst]

Originally posted by SonnetCelestial
My forum was around 110MB and had quite a few posters. those who have seen it say that it should cause no problem but I beg to differ... Unfortunately the dedicated route is the only way I can see a forum thriving. I am not even too sure that vBulletin can fnction on virtual accounts after hearing the usage of Memory it needs for popular forums. This may be a PHP related issue but again realistically speaking why are people having problems on a dedicated server now and trying to press for more ram?

It is all scaring me quite thoroughly. I'm not sure what to pick now and I'm glad I have not yet decided on which forum to use.

Hi SonnetCelestial,

I have a UBB forum that was around 100 Mb (hosted on CT) after two months (with only around 550 members but they used to post a lot). Now because I do not want to take the risk to have my account suspended, I prune it very often to keep it under 40 Mb. I also disabled the search function. From what I read lately on CT's support forum, they still recommend UBB, so I don't want to convert my UBB to Vbulletin for now (but I am still thinking about converting it and then move the board to Futurequest. It seems easier to move a Vbulletin than a UBB, less files anyway).

Olly

[Alwaysmefirst]

Originally posted by wandrer
The only question as to whether ubb / wwwthreads / phorum / vbulletin / webbbs could function under a given virtual / dedicated account is how much traffic is expected. vBulletin could definately handle more traffic than any of the others. It is based on a very solid foundation (php / mysql). With that said, with a certain traffic level and on the same server setup - vbulletin is far more capable than ubb. It could handle more users, more posts, more everything.

Hi wandrer,

UBB is known not to work well with RAQ 2 and RAQ 3. Is it the same with Vbulletin?
With a RAQ 3 with 160 Mb (like the one on servers.catalog.com), how many posts a day/page views do you think it can handle?
Thanks in advance for your reply.

olly

[wandrer]

they still recommend UBB

IMHO - Those that still recommend UBB haven't tried out vBulletin. I am still amazed at the possibilities. I just wish I had more time to mess around with it and really let loose with the templates to see what they could do.

Edit: If RAQ's support PHP and mySQL (which I believe they support) then running vBulletin is easy. I must say, though, that I have been wanting to try out a RAQ3, but just haven't had the chance yet.




[Edited by wandrer on 05-30-2000 at 04:57 PM]

[Alwaysmefirst]

Originally posted by wandrer
they still recommend UBB

IMHO - Those that still recommend UBB haven't tried out vBulletin. I am still amazed at the possibilities. I just wish I had more time to mess around with it and really let loose with the templates to see what they could do.

Edit: If RAQ's support PHP and mySQL (which I believe they support) then running vBulletin is easy. I must say, though, that I have been wanting to try out a RAQ3, but just haven't had the chance yet.


Thanks for your fast reply :)
When I wrote "they still recommend UBB", I meant the CT administrators, that's the only reason I am worried about using Vbulletin with that web host. I am totally convinced by Vbulletin's possibilities and love the way we can customize it. Just waiting for the next weekend to work more on it!

Olly

[Dragon]

I just got spam from Communitech today, therefore they are permanently off my list of possible hosts.

[doron]

I've decided to get VB and actually try to install it on CT. My board is not that big/active, but is the biggest money source on one of my sites.

I'll report my findings here.

[Josh]

Here is some information from the Communitech.net Support area...


How does CommuniTech.Net run PHP?

CommuniTech.Net offers PHP as an Apache module, not as a CGI binary. Thus, clients can take advantage of the benefits of using PHP as an Apache module.


~Josh

[Shoe]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by evoir
[B]Communitech. They seem (on paper) like a dreamboat....But I have heard BAD stories about them. BAD tech support....bad bad.

Would love to hear from folks about that!

:( :( :( I've tried them out now for two days and it feels like a prison! Everywhere you go they slam a LONG page of rules and ways they will restrict you. Honestly, I haven't felt this bad since high school. Yeah, they seem to offer you everything, and then squeese your use. That's the impression I get. Also, where is the tech suport? Why should I wait over 24 hours for a reply? It's just not friendly and I will probably leave them in a day or two. :( :( :(

[Shoe]

doron: do you have Vbulletin installed on a CT account? I use CT and FQ as web hosts and plan to buy and install Vbulletin this weekend. I would like to know how it works at CT.

Whose FQ?

[doron]

Go to the support boards, they are a big help and often faster than support.

As for the restrictions, they are just there so that people won't take too many resources. I've been on their saturn server for over a year and have no big complaint (other than their BB issue) about them.

But, if you leave them, more bandwith for me ;)

[Josh]

I have been using Communitech.Net for a little over six months now and have no real problems.

I recently (Friday) bought and installed vBulletin on their servers with no real problems. It runs better than UBB ever did on any of my servers.

~Josh

[robot]

I used to be a CT customer, but they screwed with me way too much.. So I moved to a dedicated server with a different company. Oddly enough I now have a webhosting company.. lol

[NetFXMedia]

I host with communitech.net, have been for a year. Maybe they like me or something or don't pay attention to me. I havnt been billed in awhile haha, think the term ended 2 months ago and they still didn't bill me. I transfer 1 gig of bandwidth a day and am 150 megs over my limit. I better get under disk quota, if they really do hound ya. For hosting vbulletin im going to use my other host, planetz.net which is very friendly and relyable, cheap too.
Check them out if your looking to host a vbulletin.

[SonnetCelestial]

Well vblite works under my account at ct. It seems fast but then again there is no load right now.

All I want to know is...can ct grow with the load if they allow

5 databases at a total of 5 users. I have no idea what the maximum connections are and I couldn't locate more info...

Well that's that! :)

[SonnetCelestial]

I should have edited my last one but when I mean fast, I mean VERY fast now. I've had lots of my forumers stress test and they are all very happy currently. I'm almost afraid it is too fast because I would be frightened of the possible server load. Almost too good to be true and I'm very tempted to get vb.

[Edited by SonnetCelestial on 06-30-2000 at 10:20 PM]

[werehere]

Cannot complain about speed though :)


What I would worry about now though it the possibility of your forums becoming so popular because they are fast that you will need more hardware, but then again that is the price you have to pay for a popular web site.

Just run with it while it is there. :)

[Edited by werehere on 07-01-2000 at 01:01 AM]

[doron]

that is the main advantage of CT - there servers are very beefy, especially their MySQL ones.

just hope they upgrade to php4 and zend...

[SonnetCelestial]

:) Well I have to learn SQL now. I do hope that someone can fix the digibuy thing soon since I still cannot buy vbulletin......

However I am aching to get the code now that I've seen for myself witha side by side comparison how much faster it really is.

[Bomb]

After I checked out CommuniTech's web site, they certainly seemed to be the host to use. I was wrong.

While I wasn't directly affected, one of my staff members was. He opened an account with CommuniTech and told me how good it was, and a few months later that all changed. He had a counter script that he forgot about (he placed it on his UBB as a hack) and did not realize it was resource intensive. Who ever thought of a counter being resource intensive anyway?

Did CommuniTech email him and notify him so he could correct the problem? No. They told him he had one hour to get his stuff off of their machine since they were cancelling his account. All they had to do was contact him and tell him, and he would've removed it. Instead, they zap accounts that use the slightest amount of power and won't refund your money.

Customer service? Hardly. Be careful out there. :)

~Bomb

[SonnetCelestial]

Hello Bomb..

Well I heard Futurequest was very good and I may try it out as soon as I cash in my paycheck today.

As for Communitech.net, if you are a hobbyist it's definitely not a bad site, however if you are going commercial don't rely on them. I run a hobbyist site and so far it is fast althoug not too user friendly. They're not too keen over there at customer support but they're all right. All I have to do now is import all those e-mail addresses! :(

[Dave#]

CT Support ticket

Hello, thank you for your ticket. Since PHP is compiled to Apache, the scripts you run will run will run as nobody, so it will be very hard to determine what script is causing the problem. We have yet to suspend any from running any PHP Bulletin board because of this reason. Additionally, PHP tends to be handled a lot better by our servers than the Perl-based UBB, so you should have a lot fewer problems with it. Thank you for your concern in regards to the issue. Have a good day.